03-26-2019, 11:48 AM.bojo Wrote: This more about Slappy's point where he just brought up a suggestion and people are being surprisingly defensive about why he's doing it.
It still makes sense to me. We don't allow people to switch on even strength, mostly because of realism. It's being suggested that maybe it makes sense to do something similar for special teams. Even the argument about "some defenders do play forward in the nhl" was brought up when we made the even strength change, yet it was still done.
To me, we should be factoring in minutes played. Having a defenseman play forward at 5v5 is a lot different (to me) than a forward playing defense on the PK. We don't let people change willy-nilly because then you could just keep changing to suit your team's biggest need, and that (to me) would be a problem, but changing positions isn't a problem in and of itself just the volume of changes. Restricting GMs options on special teams is just a bad idea (says the GM lol) and I don't think we would benefit from it in any measurable way.
It may restrict GM options slightly, but I still think it's good. The even strength thing would be much more restricting, and that has gone over well so far. It'll never be 1-1 realistic, but that's still the vision we have for the sim. Otherwise we'd do the newer engine or version thing that people say has crazy outcomes.
Small disclaimer: I'm honestly ok no matter which happens. I didn't even know teams did it, and based on the thread I'm assuming Minny did it. But don't take my opinion to mean they did something bad. I just liked Boom's suggestion.
03-26-2019, 04:29 PMGrapehead Wrote: To me, we should be factoring in minutes played. Having a defenseman play forward at 5v5 is a lot different (to me) than a forward playing defense on the PK. We don't let people change willy-nilly because then you could just keep changing to suit your team's biggest need, and that (to me) would be a problem, but changing positions isn't a problem in and of itself just the volume of changes. Restricting GMs options on special teams is just a bad idea (says the GM lol) and I don't think we would benefit from it in any measurable way.
It may restrict GM options slightly, but I still think it's good. The even strength thing would be much more restricting, and that has gone over well so far. It'll never be 1-1 realistic, but that's still the vision we have for the sim. Otherwise we'd do the newer engine or version thing that people say has crazy outcomes.
Small disclaimer: I'm honestly ok no matter which happens. I didn't even know teams did it, and based on the thread I'm assuming Minny did it. But don't take my opinion to mean they did something bad. I just liked Boom's suggestion.
Depends on what you consider realistic I guess, cause I see this PK rule as unrealistic. My biggest gripe with the thing is that it just isn't an issue, but if for some reason this gains traction and gets implemented I'm not going to protest lol but really I'm not sure any other team has tried this besides Minny in S46 and it went really poorly for them I believe
03-26-2019, 04:45 PM.bojo Wrote: It may restrict GM options slightly, but I still think it's good. The even strength thing would be much more restricting, and that has gone over well so far. It'll never be 1-1 realistic, but that's still the vision we have for the sim. Otherwise we'd do the newer engine or version thing that people say has crazy outcomes.
Small disclaimer: I'm honestly ok no matter which happens. I didn't even know teams did it, and based on the thread I'm assuming Minny did it. But don't take my opinion to mean they did something bad. I just liked Boom's suggestion.
Depends on what you consider realistic I guess, cause I see this PK rule as unrealistic. My biggest gripe with the thing is that it just isn't an issue, but if for some reason this gains traction and gets implemented I'm not going to protest lol but really I'm not sure any other team has tried this besides Minny in S46 and it went really poorly for them I believe
Yes, it went terrible for Minnesota. Their PK did better without him on PK defense than it did with, but teams just slotting in forwards for everything these days. 2 of the top 3 teams in PP run the 5F strat, but I have my doubts that it's actually due to the forwards being loaded up there but that's not the main point here.
We got that 12m pay wall to keep players from going 'Oh i'll be the best forward and then win the stevens' and for teams to not just flip a player to whatever they needed without making trades/moves. Endurance clearly has no effect for skaters.We keep diminishing defensemenAin't nobody irl realistically runs a 5F strat with any regularity, mainly due to fatigue.
It doesn't have to be some restriction on these strats, maybe we can figure out another alternative.
03-26-2019, 06:05 PMSwegButthole Wrote: Skellefteå has succesfully played a 5 forward PP for like 10 years in the SHL
How do they use it?
I'll b honest I have never seen a SHL game in my life. If there's a certain game time they play at maybe you can let me know and I might catch a game of theirs to check it out.
03-26-2019, 04:56 PMGrapehead Wrote: Depends on what you consider realistic I guess, cause I see this PK rule as unrealistic. My biggest gripe with the thing is that it just isn't an issue, but if for some reason this gains traction and gets implemented I'm not going to protest lol but really I'm not sure any other team has tried this besides Minny in S46 and it went really poorly for them I believe
Yes, it went terrible for Minnesota. Their PK did better without him on PK defense than it did with, but teams just slotting in forwards for everything these days. 2 of the top 3 teams in PP run the 5F strat, but I have my doubts that it's actually due to the forwards being loaded up there but that's not the main point here.
We got that 12m pay wall to keep players from going 'Oh i'll be the best forward and then win the stevens' and for teams to not just flip a player to whatever they needed without making trades/moves. Endurance clearly has no effect for skaters.We keep diminishing defensemenAin't nobody irl realistically runs a 5F strat with any regularity, mainly due to fatigue.
It doesn't have to be some restriction on these strats, maybe we can figure out another alternative.
How would you feel about getting rid of the $12m option for changing position, and then we give each player one change to use in their career? Personally, I think the $12m is a bit ridiculous.
03-26-2019, 08:57 PM(This post was last modified: 03-26-2019, 08:59 PM by Daco.)
I'm both impressed and shocked that this thread about playing people on special teams (which is normal and just butthurt certain someone) still has any traction, but I guess it devolved into a separate topic
03-26-2019, 08:58 PM(This post was last modified: 03-26-2019, 09:12 PM by Daco.)
03-26-2019, 08:25 PMGrapehead Wrote:
03-26-2019, 06:10 PMBoomcheck Wrote: Yes, it went terrible for Minnesota. Their PK did better without him on PK defense than it did with, but teams just slotting in forwards for everything these days. 2 of the top 3 teams in PP run the 5F strat, but I have my doubts that it's actually due to the forwards being loaded up there but that's not the main point here.
We got that 12m pay wall to keep players from going 'Oh i'll be the best forward and then win the stevens' and for teams to not just flip a player to whatever they needed without making trades/moves. Endurance clearly has no effect for skaters.We keep diminishing defensemenAin't nobody irl realistically runs a 5F strat with any regularity, mainly due to fatigue.
It doesn't have to be some restriction on these strats, maybe we can figure out another alternative.
How would you feel about getting rid of the $12m option for changing position, and then we give each player one change to use in their career? Personally, I think the $12m is a bit ridiculous.
I tried to pay $12million to change positions and eggy wouldn't let me. Can we talk about that? Now I have to spend an entire 20 seasons career playing a position I don't want to because someone couldn't make the call and say "oh ya since that's literally my job as commissioner to navigate the enforcement of rules and adjust as necessary; I can allow you to do that position change even though you're a goalie and I hadn't thought of that possibility before but I'll improve the system as a result since we do have a rule saying you can change positions, and (goalies excluded) isn't written in there and I would hate to ruin your enjoyment of the league just because I didn't catch what my own league's rules say and I have no power to make decisions of my own in the league I am commissioner of to help users enjoy their experience".
03-26-2019, 06:10 PMBoomcheck Wrote: Yes, it went terrible for Minnesota. Their PK did better without him on PK defense than it did with, but teams just slotting in forwards for everything these days. 2 of the top 3 teams in PP run the 5F strat, but I have my doubts that it's actually due to the forwards being loaded up there but that's not the main point here.
We got that 12m pay wall to keep players from going 'Oh i'll be the best forward and then win the stevens' and for teams to not just flip a player to whatever they needed without making trades/moves. Endurance clearly has no effect for skaters.We keep diminishing defensemenAin't nobody irl realistically runs a 5F strat with any regularity, mainly due to fatigue.
It doesn't have to be some restriction on these strats, maybe we can figure out another alternative.
How would you feel about getting rid of the $12m option for changing position, and then we give each player one change to use in their career? Personally, I think the $12m is a bit ridiculous.
People did abuse position changing before the 12M pay wall was put in, so I am in favor of it.
Though like Daco says there could be someone in a very rough situation, lets say a new player.
Before I would say just recreate, mainly because there was this trend of people easily fighting off regression for prolonged careers. You're old and want to play a diff position? Recreate or pay the 12M.
But the new/young player doesn't fall into this. Maybe allow it for the entirety of an ELC max deal? Draft+3 seasons? That's generally before they become an elite positional player and figure things out.
03-26-2019, 08:25 PMGrapehead Wrote: How would you feel about getting rid of the $12m option for changing position, and then we give each player one change to use in their career? Personally, I think the $12m is a bit ridiculous.
I tried to pay $12million to change positions and eggy wouldn't let me. Can we talk about that? Now I have to spend an entire 20 seasons career playing a position I don't want to because someone couldn't make the call and say "oh ya since that's literally my job as commissioner to navigate the enforcement of rules and adjust as necessary; I can allow you to do that position change even though you're a goalie and I hadn't thought of that possibility before but I'll improve the system as a result since we do have a rule saying you can change positions, and (goalies excluded) isn't written in there and I would hate to ruin your enjoyment of the league just because I didn't catch what my own league's rules say and I have no power to make decisions of my own in the league I am commissioner of to help users enjoy their experience".
LMFAO WHAT
This isn't really on Eggy or HO at all. Don't try and make people feel bad for you, you know where the retirement subforum is.
03-26-2019, 06:05 PMSwegButthole Wrote: Skellefteå has succesfully played a 5 forward PP for like 10 years in the SHL
How do they use it?
I'll b honest I have never seen a SHL game in my life. If there's a certain game time they play at maybe you can let me know and I might catch a game of theirs to check it out.
It's our standard 1st PP in any situation. Or has been at least, this season we've started playing some 4F and 1D because we've finally gotten a D man who can play offense, something we havent seen since Klingberg left.
We're in the first round of the playoffs right now and the games are usually at 7pm CET.
03-26-2019, 08:25 PMGrapehead Wrote: How would you feel about getting rid of the $12m option for changing position, and then we give each player one change to use in their career? Personally, I think the $12m is a bit ridiculous.
People did abuse position changing before the 12M pay wall was put in, so I am in favor of it.
Though like Daco says there could be someone in a very rough situation, lets say a new player.
Before I would say just recreate, mainly because there was this trend of people easily fighting off regression for prolonged careers. You're old and want to play a diff position? Recreate or pay the 12M.
But the new/young player doesn't fall into this. Maybe allow it for the entirety of an ELC max deal? Draft+3 seasons? That's generally before they become an elite positional player and figure things out.
I think the one free change per player would cover all scenarios for someone wanting to make a position change, cause you could use it at any point you like. The ELC idea I like, but think it'd be a good idea to limit it to first gen players.
03-27-2019, 07:07 AM(This post was last modified: 03-27-2019, 07:09 AM by Baelor Swift.)
03-25-2019, 10:10 PMSlappydoodle Wrote:
03-25-2019, 09:55 PMGrapehead Wrote: I dunno... I think everything's going pretty civil in this thread. Several people have come into the thread to disagree with boomcheck, but he's had reasonable exchanges with each person it would seem. Just because people don't agree with someone's suggestion, doesn't mean they're "yelling down dissenting voices". Maybe I missed someone throwing unnecessary insults, but I didn't see any really heated posts in this thread so I'm not sure this is one to rally the troops around.
I see people asking if someone’s being “purposefully dense”, “lmfao”, a few “smh”. What is shaking your head at someone other than expressing ridicule at the idiocy of their suggestions? Stating that the HO is too busy to deal with such pettiness? This is a suggestion thread. It is specifically what it’s here for. I’m not saying this is world war three. But this is absolutely not a civil discourse. Arguing for or against a proposal is one thing. It’s the habit of impugning the motives of others and trying to ridicule their thoughts that I have a problem with.
I told Boomcheck 5F PP is an occasionally used tactic in the NHL and then he went and argued about it not being a consistently used tactic, which is completely not what I said. Of course I'm going to call that out because he's not even trying to debate what's being said, he's twisting my words to better fit his argument. That is either being purposefully dense (ignoring and changing others' points to fit his stance, which he has done repeatedly) or just being dense in general. Discussion involves listening and acknowledging the what the other side said. He did not do that.
08-24-2018, 01:08 PMWannabeFinn Wrote: Ah yes, the veteran meme player. A surefire bet for maybe 400 TPE
03-26-2019, 08:58 PMDaco Wrote: I tried to pay $12million to change positions and eggy wouldn't let me. Can we talk about that? Now I have to spend an entire 20 seasons career playing a position I don't want to because someone couldn't make the call and say "oh ya since that's literally my job as commissioner to navigate the enforcement of rules and adjust as necessary; I can allow you to do that position change even though you're a goalie and I hadn't thought of that possibility before but I'll improve the system as a result since we do have a rule saying you can change positions, and (goalies excluded) isn't written in there and I would hate to ruin your enjoyment of the league just because I didn't catch what my own league's rules say and I have no power to make decisions of my own in the league I am commissioner of to help users enjoy their experience".
LMFAO WHAT
This isn't really on Eggy or HO at all. Don't try and make people feel bad for you, you know where the retirement subforum is.
But why can't he just pay The 12M and change positions instead of starting over? I dont see why F and D can do it but not goalies.
03-27-2019, 09:44 AM(This post was last modified: 03-27-2019, 09:45 AM by grok.)
03-27-2019, 08:49 AMLeppish Wrote:
03-26-2019, 10:33 PMJSS Wrote: LMFAO WHAT
This isn't really on Eggy or HO at all. Don't try and make people feel bad for you, you know where the retirement subforum is.
But why can't he just pay The 12M and change positions instead of starting over? I dont see why F and D can do it but not goalies.
Ngl that doesn't sound like an awesome idea. Sounds pretty abusable. I imagine that rule would get reversed in a single season after a 1.3k retiree switches to goaltender and puts up elite numbers.
EDIT: Actually wait, why wouldn't literally everyone switch to goaltender when they regress to 1k or less? You can still be good to very good at 800 TPE as a goaltender and sit there for another six seasons.
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