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Lazyeye · 06-16-2019, 01:54 PM

Hello fellow photoshoppers, Gimp users, and paint connoisseurs. I would like to take a moment of your time and discuss a few changes that will be occurring in the graphics section starting tomorrow in terms of grading.

First, I would like to give you a break down of the hierarchy of our grading team. We have seen a lot of changes over the past couple seasons, ushering in a lot of improvement over that time. I would like to extend a special thanks to the grading team, y’all have done exceptionally well over the past few seasons, have raised the bar for grading, and have been quite a bit more expedient than previous iterations of the team.

Our team is as follows

@Lazyeye – Graphics Head
@karey – Main arbitrator
@Julio Tokolosh – Grader
@Carpy48 – Grader
@GeckoeyGecko – “Grader”
@hewasajazzman – Grader
@Bruins10 – Grader
@Im_A_Boonana - Grader
@Gray – Grader
@ligma - Grader
@chetib – Video Grader

Now on to the few changes

The first change you’ll see, which will take place tomorrow, is a revised grading and pay scale. The current rubric and pay scale on the forums will be removed and replaced. The new scale will condense the scoring into a 1-5/5 scale and you will earn 250k per point that you receive per submission. We will not be objectifying the scores through examples, jersey changes, animation, and all that jazz. There will be general guidelines and the score will be up to subjectivity of the graders. I would predict the average score would be between a 2-3 out of 5 for a majority of the sig makers here. Half points will be utilized as well (125k per half)
Here are the general guidelines

Code:
1 – User demonstrates a basic level of photoshop (or any other photo manipulation software) and has the necessary elements required in a signature. The signature includes a photo, background and text. 250k  

2- User demonstrates a baseline knowledge of the tools within photoshop and shows some understanding of lighting, depth, flow, and other artistic elements. User has shown they have surpassed the beginning levels of photoshop. 500k

3- User demonstrates effective use of photoshop tools to create a quality signature. All aspects of lighting, depth, flow, color, and creativity are present within the signature. There is still room for improvement but the user now has a good understanding of sig making. 750k

4- User demonstrates an advanced knowledge of the tools in photoshop. They are expertly utilizing artistic elements such as lighting, depth, etc, to create a high-quality signature. 1 mil

5- Cream of the crop. A very rare score for an expert-quality signature that demonstrates a high level of artistic ability and cohesiveness. 1.25 mil

The vagueness of the new guideline is intentional. I am attempting to remove the hard limits such as jersey swaps and animation out of the guideline but this will increase the subjectivity of grading, which will fall on the graders. To combat this is the reason the score is being reduced to 5 instead of 10. This should intrinsically reduce the deviation of subjectivity between graders. At the same time, a vaguer guideline with no hard limits will allow users to be more creative in their signatures and not worry so much about checking certain blocks to hit higher scores. We here at the graphics section want to see people improve and flex those creative muscles when it comes to signature. Hopefully by reducing the scale and removing certain hard limits we have begun down that path. Grading itself will remain relatively the same except for a bit more emphasis in the comments on how and where to improve.

There will always be grading issues when it comes to subjectivity. In order to combat this, I will be introducing an arbitration thread in the next week or so once I finalize the format. This will give users a couple weeks after receiving their grade to contest their score if they feel they weren’t graded properly. Now this isn’t something you will be posting in every week, but just on occasion if you feel you were slighted in a score. At this time, karey and I will be the arbitrators. Once the thread goes up, there will be a specific format to follow and karey and I will decide whether we concur with the grader or to bump up your pay. I don’t really expect any issues in terms of abuse for arbitration, but we will keep a close eye on how it goes this season.

For the near future, I’m going to be working on some consolidation and reorganizing of the forums. In my opinion, the current forums are somewhat stretched thin with resources so I feel a consolidation is needed. I will also be hosting another full-blown sig tourney at the beginning of the next off season.

That is all the changes that will be introduced at this time. The new grading scale and payment system will be in effect for all submissions after 6/16. If anyone has any questions or concerns about the new system then I would be happy to answer them. If not, then I look forward to seeing your pretty sigs!

Tomasnz · 06-16-2019, 02:15 PM

Scale Seems fine.

But. Imo removing the focus on jersey swaps is a mistake.

My best example is a graphic without shl specific branding (ie branding of the NHL) would be similar to someone writing a really good article about the recent NHL playoffs and submitting it for grading in the shl media section.

It's not about the time and effort taken. It is about helping this site feel like a seperate and different place from the real world.

Graphics without shl team branding break the perception we have of the site.

Like I'm just someone that likes looking through the graphics section to see cool stuff. But I have zero interest in graphics that don't at least try to pretend to be in the SHL.

Ninja edit to add a productive note:
My suggestion would be use the new scale and just half the payout if it isn't SHL branded.

I know what I am saying seems a little harsh, but this is about creating creative SHL graphics, not a portfolio for graphics generally (there are other sites for that).

Lazyeye · 06-16-2019, 02:26 PM

06-16-2019, 02:15 PMTomasnz Wrote: Scale Seems fine.

But. Imo removing the focus on jersey swaps is a mistake.

My best example is a graphic without shl specific branding (ie branding of the NHL) would be similar to someone writing a really good article about the recent NHL playoffs and submitting it for grading in the shl media section.

It's not about the time and effort taken. It is about helping this site feel like a seperate and different place from the real world.

Graphics without shl team branding break the perception we have of the site.

Like I'm just someone that likes looking through the graphics section to see cool stuff. But I have zero interest in graphics that don't at least try to pretend to be in the SHL.

I'm not saying don't do jersey swaps, but I'm just trying to remove that hard limit of you aren't getting a 8/10 because you didn't do a jersey swap. I would rather people focus more time into an actual sig than get hemmed up on a jersey swap. There will still be numerous people doing jersey swaps throughout the site. I'm aiming to make it something that enhances the sig, but doesn't define a score if that makes sense

That being said, I understand your SHL identity thing but I think that will still be maintained a lot through the text work on the sigs.

crutch · 06-16-2019, 02:26 PM

great change thank you lazyeye

Tomasnz · 06-16-2019, 02:32 PM

06-16-2019, 02:26 PMLazyeye Wrote: I'm not saying don't do jersey swaps, but I'm just trying to remove that hard limit of you aren't getting a 8/10 because you didn't do a jersey swap. I would rather people focus more time into an actual sig than get hemmed up on a jersey swap. There will still be numerous people doing jersey swaps throughout the site. I'm aiming to make it something that enhances the sig, but doesn't define a score if that makes sense

That being said, I understand your SHL identity thing but I think that will still be maintained a lot through the text work on the sigs.

You are saying you don't have to, which I my head suggests there will be fewer. (Although debatably doing a jersey swap is an excellent way to demonstrate mastery of lighting and other ps tools). Maybe this is a " time will see" if there is a drop off in shl branded submissions. If there is I hope you interven quivkly to encourage more again.

But also I think you are trying to work two things here. The quality scale and the payout scale, don't necessarily need to be the same. I added a suggested a minnor tweak to the approach in my original comment.

***sköldpaddor*** · 06-16-2019, 02:38 PM

I’m mobile so I’m not quoting everything relevant here but I think it’s possible to make stuff feel like a separate world without a full jersey swap. Some folks are lucky and the player they’ve picked for their render plays for a team IRL with the same colors as their SHL team - I don’t think you should get docked for that. Sometimes you’re using a closeup image that only requires some minor color tweaking on the shoulders/head rather than a full jersey swap and trying to jam a logo in there. I totally agree that if that kind of effort has gone into it, it should be rewarded, but I think you can make something that feels just as cool and unique with a closeup image or by strategically concealing anything that associates them with their real team.

ANYWAY overall I dig this!

Tomasnz · 06-16-2019, 02:41 PM

@sköldpaddor I think that's a good point. And for me I don't really care about jersey swaps as such. But I want the graphics to feel like SHL graphics. Logo/motive on the side of a goalies head mask for instance. Or just a great close up shot as the focus as you say.

Sorry not trying to shoot this down as the scale seems legit good. Just voicing my concerns about a possible impact.

BDonini · 06-16-2019, 09:03 PM

06-16-2019, 02:26 PMLazyeye Wrote:
06-16-2019, 02:15 PMTomasnz Wrote: Scale Seems fine.

But. Imo removing the focus on jersey swaps is a mistake.

My best example is a graphic without shl specific branding (ie branding of the NHL) would be similar to someone writing a really good article about the recent NHL playoffs and submitting it for grading in the shl media section.

It's not about the time and effort taken. It is about helping this site feel like a seperate and different place from the real world.

Graphics without shl team branding break the perception we have of the site.

Like I'm just someone that likes looking through the graphics section to see cool stuff. But I have zero interest in graphics that don't at least try to pretend to be in the SHL.

I'm not saying don't do jersey swaps, but I'm just trying to remove that hard limit of you aren't getting a 8/10 because you didn't do a jersey swap. I would rather people focus more time into an actual sig than get hemmed up on a jersey swap. There will still be numerous people doing jersey swaps throughout the site. I'm aiming to make it something that enhances the sig, but doesn't define a score if that makes sense

That being said, I understand your SHL identity thing but I think that will still be maintained a lot through the text work on the sigs.

How about a bonus for jersey swaps? I've seen some graders do it and thought it was a fantastic idea (if every grader does it of course).

***WannabeFinn*** · 06-16-2019, 09:22 PM

Good changes Lazyeye

*Good_Ole_Kimmy* · 06-16-2019, 09:27 PM

big big fan of this, the restrictions set by King's scale seemed good at the beginning, but in the end it just made it so that all sigs needed to follow a certain formula in order to get the highest grade. Once again making another good change, I don't think I've ever been upset by the changes you've made, keep up the good work.

Lazyeye · 06-16-2019, 10:19 PM

06-16-2019, 09:03 PMBDonini Wrote:
06-16-2019, 02:26 PMLazyeye Wrote: I'm not saying don't do jersey swaps, but I'm just trying to remove that hard limit of you aren't getting a 8/10 because you didn't do a jersey swap. I would rather people focus more time into an actual sig than get hemmed up on a jersey swap. There will still be numerous people doing jersey swaps throughout the site. I'm aiming to make it something that enhances the sig, but doesn't define a score if that makes sense

That being said, I understand your SHL identity thing but I think that will still be maintained a lot through the text work on the sigs.

How about a bonus for jersey swaps? I've seen some graders do it and thought it was a fantastic idea (if every grader does it of course).

As of now we haven't come to a unified consensus on how to implement. There are some that agree with bonuses, some that don't and then we also have the argument on what quality of jersey swap is deserving of a bonus if so

That being said, I'll keep an eye on how this scale changing sigs during this season, if it does at all, and reassess next off-season if we need to incentive jersey changes

JNH · 06-16-2019, 10:21 PM

06-16-2019, 02:15 PMTomasnz Wrote: My best example is a graphic without shl specific branding (ie branding of the NHL) would be similar to someone writing a really good article about the recent NHL playoffs and submitting it for grading in the shl media section.

This isn't a good example at all. One is writing about Pietrangelo and calling it an SHL article. The other is taking a picture of Pietrangelo, editing it heavily, naming him something else to portray a character and then posting for the use of someone who is more or less roleplaying as him - which is therefore SHL relevant.

I like Donini's idea of a bonus. I don't mind colour changes but depending on the render, logo change can really detract from a sig in some cases, even when done as well as possible. If the artist wants to do them, go for it and reward it. If the artist drops an insane sig and it doesn't have a jersey change, can still reward that too.

Good change guys. I like the look on the surface and I'm sure it'll be executed well.

*Zoone16* · 06-16-2019, 10:43 PM

@Lazyeye So besides photoshop, where do other digital media fit in the updated grading scale? For example, Paint sigs?

Lazyeye · 06-16-2019, 11:08 PM

06-16-2019, 10:43 PMZoone16 Wrote: @Lazyeye So besides photoshop, where do other digital media fit in the updated grading scale? For example, Paint sigs?

That is something that has been brought up as well. While mostly we focus on photoshop, gimp, etc, we don't have a category for stuff like paint. We are looking to remedy that but its currently in its infancy

Currently though, we will try to apply our new scale to paint sigs, sort of how we graded geckos pixel sigs in the past. We understand that its a different set of tools and limitation so we will try to grade it as fairly as possible.

*Katth* · 06-17-2019, 04:43 AM

Good changes and also clear descriptions per grade. As someone relatively new into sig making or photoshop at all for that matter it makes more sense to me now and gives me goals to work on.

As far as the jersey swapping concerns. I think jersey swaps will obviously keep happening. A proper jersey swap shows you meet certain skill requirements to get a higher grade.

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