So with the upcoming change to FHM6 and people discussing all of the possible builds i decided to take a look at what the builds of the top players on each team were and what TPE it would take to replicate such a build using the current TPE scale. Gotta give credit to @golden_apricot because I used a copy of his google sheets page to calculate the TPE totals of each player.
A few notes and disclaimers, I didn't use the same amount of players from each team but i tried to have at least 1 center, 1 wing, and 1 defenceman from each team as well as their top goalie. Also some skaters such as McDavid and Matthews have stats above 20 so i limited those stats to 20. Also on a rare occasion some skaters had stats lower than 5 so i have those got rounded up to 5. Also because we are only able to put TPE in two of the mental ratings (Aggression and Bravery for skaters, and Mental Toughness and Stamina for Goalies) those stats are not accounted for in the TPE total. So players with more than 15 points in those stats are under indexed in TPE and those with fewer that 15 points are over indexed. Also when looking at a players position and Role i took the highest that the game listed, and in the case of roles when there was a tie (noted by and * next to the role) i just picked which ever i felt was right, sorry if you think player xyz should have been a Setup-Man instead of a Dangler.
Here is the link to the data i used for those who like spreadsheets.
As i have noticed some articles have neglected goalies recently I am going to start with them. With 31 goalies polled the average TPE was 929.13 with the Highest being 1208 by Pekka Rinne in Nashville and the lowest being 656 by Mackenzie Blackwood in New Jersey. The average stats for each were as follows
So the Top 5 skills were Positioning and Reflexes both at 16, Recovery at 15.58, and the Mental Toughness, Pokecheck and Glove all at 15.32. Mental Toughness, Pokecheck and Glove also all had the smallest spread with the highest being 17 and the lowest being 14 across all of the goalies
The Bottom 5 skills were Skating at 14.39, Passing at 14.61, Puck Handling at 14.9, and Rebounds and Low Shots at 15.13. Skating had the highest spread with 6 a high side of 17 and a low end of 11.
One thing we will see when we look at the skater builds is that the goalies had much more average and evenly spread out stats than skaters. No goalie had a stat above 18 or a stat below 11, where as every stat for the skaters besides fighting had at least one player at 18 or above, and the lowest stat for a player in any given category was anywhere from 5 to 14 for the skaters
Next we will look at all of the skaters, forwards and defenseman, combined. Of the players looked at Connor McDavid had the Highest TPE build at 2679, which should be even higher as McDavid has 6 stats above 20. Passing and Offensive Read at 22 and Puck Handling, Acceleration, Agility, and Speed at 21. Also all of his Mental Stats that we are not using are all above 15. The lowest player surveyed was David Krejci at 697 TPE, i think this is because Krejci’s stats are a lot more even than most players, with the majority of his ranking falling between 13 and 17 with only one stat at 18 which was Team Player so it wasnt factored in.
The average stats of all of the skaters are as follows:
The Top 5 stats were Stamina at 16.94, Puck Handling at 16.48, Passing at 16.09, Offensive Reading at 15.99 and Balance at 15.89. Stamina, Balance, and Bravery all had the lowest spread of 6 with Stamina ranging from 20-14, Balance from 19-13 and Bravery from 18-12.
The Bottom 5 skills were Fighting at 6.59, Aggression at 7.79, Shot Blocking at 8.82, Shooting Range at 10.34, and Faceoffs at 11.35. The skills with the highest spread were Shooting Accuracy ranging from 20-6, Shooting Range going from 19-5 and Aggression from 18-5.
The first two stats in the bottom 5 make sense as only players who are focused on fighting or aggression would have points in those. I believe the next two are due to the fact that there are a major of the skaters are forwards and would have less points in Shot Blocking and Shooting Range than a Defenceman, and the 5th stat is there because for the most part only centers and a few wingers would have many points in faceoffs. However it is interesting that all of the skaters listed, even all the defencemen, have at least a 6 rating in faceoffs. Brent Burns has the highest faceoffs of a Defenceman at 10 only 1 point behind the lowest Center of Pierre-Luc Dubois at 11.
Now I'm going to split up the skaters into three groups: Centers, Wingers, and Defenseman.
First up are Centers, which have the same highest and lowest TPE skaters of Conor McDavid and David Krejci. Their average stats were as follows:
The Top 5 stats for Centers are: Stamina at 16.98, Offensive Read at 16.88, Puck Handling at 16.73, Passing at 16.58, and Shooting Accuracy at 16.52. And of those stats Stamina had the lowest spread of 5, going from 20 to 15.
The Bottom 5 stats are Fighting at 6.48, Shot Blocking 7.15, Shooting Range 7.46, Aggression at 7.69, and Hitting at 11.88. Aggression had the largest spread of 8, ranging from 13 to 5. And Shot Blocking had a spread of only 2.
Fighting and Aggression are obvious as we will see them in all of the groups. Shooting range and Shot Blocking seem to be stats for a defender, but the interesting one on the list is Hitting as this is the only Top or Bottom 5 that it appears on. Also it is interesting the Faceoffs aren't closer to the top, at an average of 14.9 it ranks 12th out of the 23 stats.
Next are Wingers. Their top TPE player is Alex Ovechkin at 2126 and the lowest is Tyler Toffoli at 1055. There average stats are as follows:
The top stats for wingers are: Shooting Accuracy at 16.8, Offensive Read at 16.57, Getting Open at 16.48, Stamina at 16.37, and Puck Handling at 16.36. And again of these skills Stamina has the smallest spread of 5 ranging from 19 to 14.
The bottom stats are Fighting at 6.75, SHot blocking at 6.96, Shooting Range at 7.63, Aggression at 7.93, and Faceoffs at 11.76. Unlike Centers Aggression has the largest spread of 13 ranging from 18 to 5, with the two players at 18 being Evander Kane and Milan Lucic.
It is interesting how the Wingers have a higher Shooting Accuracy and Getting Open where as the Centers have a higher Passing and Offensive Read. It seems like the wingers are the shooter/snipers and the centers are the playmakers. The bottoms skills all make sense, everyone has low fighting and aggression, forwards have low shot blocking and shooting range, and it also makes sense how wingers would have a low faceoffs. But there are a few wingers who have high faceoffs as well. Pavelski has a 17 faceoffs and Giroux has an 18, this makes sense as both players are seen as dual position players.
Then last up are Defenceman, their highest player is Erik Karlsson at 1954 with the lowest being Brady Skjei at 1090. And these are their average stats:
The top 5 stats for Defenceman are Stamina at 17.73, Shooting Range at 17.06, Puck Handling at 16.41, Balance at 16.31, and Agility at 16. Shooting Range and Stamina have the lowest spread of 4, with Stamina ranging from 20 to 16 and Shooting range from 19 to 15.
Their Lowest stats are Fighting at 6.45, Faceoffs at 7.41, Aggression at 7.67, Shooting Accuracy at 8.22, and Screening at 9.1. Defencemen have the most evenly spaced out build of the skaters as they have no stats with a spread of more than 9, with the greatest being strength varying from 20 to 11.
Again the top and bottom stats are pretty understandable. Balance and Agility are interesting one’s but i makes sense for Defenceman inorder to win battle on the boards and in front of the net. Screening being a bottom stat also makes sense as for the vast majority of their time on the ice they wont be anywhere near the opposing goalie to need to screen him. Chara and Byfuglien have the highest screening of 13, probably due to their size lol.
So ya that's it, again here is the link to the spreadsheet which has alot more data than i listed here, dont really know how to end this so ill leave it at this. These are just the stats that were assigned to the NHL players, take it as you will and you can build whatever you want.
02-07-2020, 04:12 PMsve7en Wrote: Hmm... If the highest NHL goalie has <1300 TPE, should the theorized scale for goalies be reconsidered?
Really cool data though, thanks for doing this!
No
I mean, it might have already been covered, and I get not wanting different update scales, but outside of that.. why?
In simonT this doesn't seem as bad, when skaters have 11 (excluding fighting) atributes compared to the 10 that goalies get, but you can make a player with the best attributes of NHL goalies for 1631 TPE. Going up to ~2k gets you basically straight 18s and a 19. I have two concerns with that - disparity in build diversity (making it that much more interesting to make a skater as a recreate or new player) and effects on sim play? I'm sure sliders and sim play can be tested and handled, but the first one seems impactful in the long term?
I mean, it might have already been covered, and I get not wanting different update scales, but outside of that.. why?
In simonT this doesn't seem as bad, when skaters have 11 (excluding fighting) atributes compared to the 10 that goalies get, but you can make a player with the best attributes of NHL goalies for 1631 TPE. Going up to ~2k gets you basically straight 18s and a 19. I have two concerns with that - disparity in build diversity (making it that much more interesting to make a skater as a recreate or new player) and effects on sim play? I'm sure sliders and sim play can be tested and handled, but the first one seems impactful in the long term?
Goalies in STH with our scale cap at around 1200 tpe. Also with the update scale you cant get all 20s and even with that I dont think we have ever had a 2k goalie. We discussed this a few nights ago. The 5th highest tpe goalie right now if we applied their tpe is comparable to a top 10 top 5 level goalie in the NHL. I think you are vastly overestimating how many goalies are top earners.
02-07-2020, 04:27 PMsve7en Wrote: I mean, it might have already been covered, and I get not wanting different update scales, but outside of that.. why?
In simonT this doesn't seem as bad, when skaters have 11 (excluding fighting) atributes compared to the 10 that goalies get, but you can make a player with the best attributes of NHL goalies for 1631 TPE. Going up to ~2k gets you basically straight 18s and a 19. I have two concerns with that - disparity in build diversity (making it that much more interesting to make a skater as a recreate or new player) and effects on sim play? I'm sure sliders and sim play can be tested and handled, but the first one seems impactful in the long term?
Goalies in STH with our scale cap at around 1200 tpe. Also with the update scale you cant get all 20s and even with that I dont think we have ever had a 2k goalie. We discussed this a few nights ago. The 5th highest tpe goalie right now if we applied their tpe is comparable to a top 10 top 5 level goalie in the NHL. I think you are vastly overestimating how many goalies are top earners.
That's fair. I appreciate the response and I'm happy to know this was already considered.
02-07-2020, 04:27 PMsve7en Wrote: I mean, it might have already been covered, and I get not wanting different update scales, but outside of that.. why?
In simonT this doesn't seem as bad, when skaters have 11 (excluding fighting) atributes compared to the 10 that goalies get, but you can make a player with the best attributes of NHL goalies for 1631 TPE. Going up to ~2k gets you basically straight 18s and a 19. I have two concerns with that - disparity in build diversity (making it that much more interesting to make a skater as a recreate or new player) and effects on sim play? I'm sure sliders and sim play can be tested and handled, but the first one seems impactful in the long term?
Goalies in STH with our scale cap at around 1200 tpe. Also with the update scale you cant get all 20s and even with that I dont think we have ever had a 2k goalie. We discussed this a few nights ago. The 5th highest tpe goalie right now if we applied their tpe is comparable to a top 10 top 5 level goalie in the NHL. I think you are vastly overestimating how many goalies are top earners.
Part of it is slightly to do with goalie eq being less TPE than skater eq which adds up over time
Credit to Copenhagen, Wasty, FlappyGiraffe, InciteHysteria, and caltroit_red_flames
02-07-2020, 04:44 PMgolden_apricot Wrote: Goalies in STH with our scale cap at around 1200 tpe. Also with the update scale you cant get all 20s and even with that I dont think we have ever had a 2k goalie. We discussed this a few nights ago. The 5th highest tpe goalie right now if we applied their tpe is comparable to a top 10 top 5 level goalie in the NHL. I think you are vastly overestimating how many goalies are top earners.
That's fair. I appreciate the response and I'm happy to know this was already considered.
no problem, if it wasnt something we have already considered im sure it would have come up soon.
On the goalie discussion, in FHM we tell it what the average goals per game it should be aiming for is, so whether every goalie is 20s across the board or 15s across the board that average goals will happen over a season. We based the scoring on previous SHL seasons so that records will be relatively close to what we are used to. In addition you'll see real life goalies become elite and stay elite for 5-6 seasons, if 1900 TPE got you to elite status it wouldn't last very long. We want goalies to have a decent life span and we want it to be slightly easier for someone to be a goalie than a skater because that's always been the way for the SHL. As a lovely added side effect we get to use the same update scale and keep a lot of things simpler because of it.
02-07-2020, 04:57 PMDrunkenTeddy Wrote: On the goalie discussion, in FHM we tell it what the average goals per game it should be aiming for is, so whether every goalie is 20s across the board or 15s across the board that average goals will happen over a season. We based the scoring on previous SHL seasons so that records will be relatively close to what we are used to. In addition you'll see real life goalies become elite and stay elite for 5-6 seasons, if 1900 TPE got you to elite status it wouldn't last very long. We want goalies to have a decent life span and we want it to be slightly easier for someone to be a goalie than a skater because that's always been the way for the SHL. As a lovely added side effect we get to use the same update scale and keep a lot of things simpler because of it.
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