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04-06-2021, 05:06 PMFlowseidon Wrote: No offense, but you post these friendly and nicely formulated messages every season at this point, but then when actual improvements are suggested you guys disappear halfway through the discussion and nothing changes. At what point does the hollow PR-talk stop and we conclude that this just isn't working?

I'd cut you some slack in regards to the ASG and not all teams being represented there, that is something that can happen when a new feature like this is set up and you have to come up with a new rule set on the fly. But the actual All-Star teams have severe problems for seasons now and if this season is any indication then they are getting worse, not better.

I hear you. Believe me. I'm not trying to do it as a PR speak, but I am genuinely interested in others opinions on what would help get the right players. Finding a problem is very easy, creating a solution is much harder. What do you suggest? I thought I had responded to everything last time, but may have missed some things. As always, my discord and PMs are open for chats.

I have received far more in terms of suggestions, possible solutions, etc than I have in my entire time. Potential solutions are very valuable, and they can be used to help drive things going forward. When it's just "these are the wrong selections" or memeing on everything/

In my opinion there are at least three important factors here that need to be looked into:

1. The voting system
2. The statistical basis
3. The discussion process

I already talked about these things a bunch in last years thread and don't wanna repeat too much of it but I can dig those posts up as well if necessary. But in a nutshell:

1. The current voting system with it's positional breakdown and the wildcards just doesn't seem to work as intended and is too messy. There are both easier and more sophisticated system out there depending on which route you wanna go and I'd suggest looking into some of those.

2. Do the Committee members have the right statistical ressources available to them to base their decisions on? Maybe this isn't them being dumb but they just don't have access to the kind of data they need or it is too hard to operate? For example there is a super helpful sheet that we work with in the awards committee that combines all the regular and advanced stats and also let's you play around with them through filters etc which is just a tremendous help... Do you guys have that sheet as well or do you use other ressources?

3. Is there an actual discussion process going on in a dedicated Discord for example, or do people just send in their ballots more or less by themselves? Drawing from my experiences in the Awards and HOF Committees again, the discussions in them are about the most valuable thing there is in the process of finding the most deserving people for this leagues honors. Bouncing ideas and different opinions off each other is super helpful and most importantly, it makes you realize your own blind spots. Krashwagen is a prime example here, he wasn't really on my radar either until someone else brought him up in our discussions and only then did I realize how great his season was. These kinds of oversights would happen to all of us all the time if it wasnt for these discussions. So does the ASG-Committee not have enough of those? Or do they exist already but someone like Krashwagen still slipped through? If that's the case then there either is something very wrong with the way these discussions are conducted or it is indeed a problem with the quality of the committee members...

And I don't wanna touch too much on individuals here but yes, you probably do need to look at the people in the committee as well and see if they are doing a good job. Because when I looked at last seasons results it was pretty clear that at least one or two voters had clear biases towards players from their own teams and that just shouldn'be acceptable in a committee like this. If you wanna save yourself the headache of calling out people like that then you can also just disband the entire committee and we re-hire those people who did a good job and who re-apply, along with some fresh blood.