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Flareon · 10-24-2019, 04:48 PM

Hey all. Today I've just posted the new and updated WJC rulebook. The majority of the rules are pre-existing rules that have been put into writing. There are some new rules however, mainly regarding actives.

Quote:B. 1. e. In the rare circumstance an active player does not have an active spot on their current nation's roster, they may play for another nation with the fewest amount of active players.

2. a. Active players must always take priority over inactives and appear on a higher line than them in 5v5 lines.
i. If a nation is found to be playing an inactive on a higher line than an active, they will be fined 3 round robin points, no exceptions.

b. Active goaltenders must start one quarter of round robin games, including backups.
i. If an active goaltender does not receive the required amount of starts, the nation will be fined 3 round robin points.
ii. If a goaltender is active, but 7 or less days away from being declared inactive, this rule may be waived at the discretion of the WJC Commissioner.

Hosting guidelines (which are inline with IIHF approved guidelines) also appear in there.

If you plan on applying to GM in the upcoming tournament, give the rulebook a read to get ahead of the game. A job posting for the positions will go up before the end of the week.

Link to rulebook

And also, a reminder to join the new WJC Discord server.

Flareon · 10-24-2019, 04:49 PM

Huge thanks to Gibbles for helping with this

ztevans · 10-24-2019, 04:49 PM

I like this.

KlusteR · 10-24-2019, 05:01 PM

Code:
B. 1. e. In the rare circumstance an active player does not have an active spot on their current nation's roster, they may play for another nation with the fewest amount of active players.

Where was that last year PepeHands

***Citizen of Adraa*** · 10-24-2019, 05:29 PM

wait we are fining sim points now?

good lord

Evok · 10-24-2019, 06:12 PM

" ii. If a goaltender is active, but 7 or less days away from being declared inactive, this rule may be waived at the discretion of the WJC Commissioner. "

Why do you keep yourself the right to waive it, like i'd like some scenario where you'd waive it and where you don't cause for me that's never a good thing to keep rights to

Flareon · 10-24-2019, 06:24 PM

10-24-2019, 06:12 PMEvok Wrote: " ii. If a goaltender is active, but 7 or less days away from being declared inactive, this rule may be waived at the discretion of the WJC Commissioner. "

Why do you keep yourself the right to waive it, like i'd like some scenario where you'd waive it and where you don't cause for me that's never a good thing to keep rights to

It's for situations where users create, don't return to the site, are still technically active, but obviously won't be active.

If for example you hadn't posted and were close to being declared inactive, I would not waive the rule.

grok · 10-24-2019, 06:46 PM

10-24-2019, 06:24 PMFlareon Wrote:
10-24-2019, 06:12 PMEvok Wrote: " ii. If a goaltender is active, but 7 or less days away from being declared inactive, this rule may be waived at the discretion of the WJC Commissioner. "

Why do you keep yourself the right to waive it, like i'd like some scenario where you'd waive it and where you don't cause for me that's never a good thing to keep rights to

It's for situations where users create, don't return to the site, are still technically active, but obviously won't be active.

If for example you hadn't posted and were close to being declared inactive, I would not waive the rule.

I think that's a weird way to write that rule. I know I typically think of "waiving" a rule as giving the party bound by the rule leeway to act in a way that is "in the spirit, against the letter." This wording is the opposite, which I find confusing.

grok · 10-24-2019, 06:51 PM

Actually going to double post about 2.B.iii because I think it's even more ambiguous. What is your interpretation of an "active". Is it a player who's active as of the first day of the tournament? Is it a sliding scale that continues throughout the duration of the tournament, where a player is considered active until they aren't? Is a player who becomes inactive at any time in the tournament considered inactive? When you add a 7 day "review period" these questions become even murkier. This is not defined in the existing rulebook, so the interpretation of this rule is not textually clear. Maybe there's a precedent someone can point me to, but I think this "7 days" exception changes any precedent too.

Flareon · 10-24-2019, 07:36 PM

@grok

how should I rewrite the rule to get its' true meaning across?

B. 1. d. states You are able to drop an inactive on the roster for an active at any point up to the medal stage of the tournament. Once an active is placed on a roster he must be played for the remainder of the tournament.

This should be reworded to "must"

grok · 10-24-2019, 10:50 PM

10-24-2019, 07:36 PMFlareon Wrote: @grok

how should I rewrite the rule to get its' true meaning across?

B. 1. d. states You are able to drop an inactive on the roster for an active at any point up to the medal stage of the tournament. Once an active is placed on a roster he must be played for the remainder of the tournament.

This should be reworded to "must"

i think it's really a question of how you want the rule to be enforced. i was kind of wrong previously? in that the rulebook has a definition of an inactive player as "any player who has not posted on the forums in the last 60 days". but this still makes the rule confusing. if a player reaches 60 days of inactivity mid-WJC, do you have to replace them with an active immediately? do you have to replace them mid-tournament?

the "seven day" commissioner option doesn't really resolve this question, it just moves the goalposts from 60 days to 53 days.

when goalie games come in, how are goalie games counted? if a goalie reaches "inactive" status mid-tournament, are their previous "active" games switched to "inactive" game immediately? do their games going from that date forward get counted as "inactive" and previous count as "active"?

i'm not sure that just changing to "must" is a clean solution because that seems like a very challenging way to enforce. if a player hits 60 days of inactivity on the same day that a 155 active creates, do you have to replace the inactive with the 155 that day? who's checking? is there daily validation? the work burden on both the GMs and the commissioner's office seem high

as for solutions:

no matter what, step one is establishing brightlines--clear, unambiguous limits. "a player is inactive on the 60th day since their last forum post" is a fine brightline. so is "active status is established at the beginning of the round robin and does not change throughout the tournament." they are both good brightlines, but have very different effects depending on what you want your enforcement mechanism to be.

step two is defining the corner cases. tell us how that brightline interacts with the goalie games rule and the mandatory replacement rule. make sure the rules and their interactions are fully explored. because if you don't do this step or don't do it well enough, you will have to interpret your rule. when you have to make an interpretation, that interpretation is competing with the expectations of the entire WJC public. exploring the corner cases first allows you to set those expectations so there's no surprises.

Keygan · 10-25-2019, 12:07 AM

I don’t think any rule in any league for any reason should be able to be waived at the commissioners discretion.

***SpartanGibbles*** · 10-25-2019, 06:06 AM

@grok

From what I understand( from my time as a WJC GM and as a new addition to WJC HO) Active status is determined at the start of the tournament and persists throughout. I know when redoing the rulebook over the last version we were trying to define as many "unspoken" rules in place but you raise a good point on defining active status.

I believe the intent behind the 7 day rule is for Goalies that create, never log back on but would still be considered active and thus cause their GMs to play them assuming they make their countries roster.

Thank you for the feedback, I am sure Flare and I will go over things again this weekend. While we can try and get everything out on try 1, being able to have an outside perspective is helpful since we might miss something taken for granted.

Flareon · 10-25-2019, 09:49 AM

I echo Gibbles comment, we're never going to nail it first time so an outside perspective is always helpful. Gibbles is correct regarding the 7 days rule. We would look into the situation and make a decision based on a variety of factors.

B. 1. c does define an inactive

Quote: You must always pick an active over an inactive. Inactive is defined as not having posted for 1 month.

***hhh81*** · 10-25-2019, 10:38 AM

jk where did grok get the 60 day comment?

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