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What worries you about switching to FHM?
#46

11-27-2019, 10:11 AMztevans Wrote:
11-27-2019, 09:44 AMTheHockeyist Wrote: I just want hockey. Who cares about sim specifics (other than the guys actually simulating)? Transfer my build and I'll be happy!

From my understanding (and correct me if I'm wrong on this), the added number of attributes doesn't really make "transferring a build" possible.  It's going to require an active and involved process of reapplying TPE in line with a new update scale and new attributes for every player in the league (including inactive, which, yeesh, you're going to need some kind of guideline in place for that I would think).
Yes everyone would technically get a full TPE redistribution and actives can do it themselves. Regarding IFA's that's something the HO will decide if we move. The goal is to release a guide once the move is set in stone and we have done enough testing to grasp the basics of builds in FHM.

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5. Buffalo Stampede , Eduard Selich 6 (Steven Stamkos Jr., Brynjar Tusk) at 19:48
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#47

When will we have a confirmation that FHM is the route we want to go (whether that is S52 or later doesn't matter)? In a perfect world, Friday would be great as it's on sale then. I'm sure many of us would rather buy it for $20 whatever then $46 it is right now. Understandably, this is a massive change and we might not have the answer by then though.

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#48

11-27-2019, 10:52 AMTomen Wrote:
11-27-2019, 10:11 AMztevans Wrote: From my understanding (and correct me if I'm wrong on this), the added number of attributes doesn't really make "transferring a build" possible.  It's going to require an active and involved process of reapplying TPE in line with a new update scale and new attributes for every player in the league (including inactive, which, yeesh, you're going to need some kind of guideline in place for that I would think).
Yes everyone would technically get a full TPE redistribution and actives can do it themselves. Regarding IFA's that's something the HO will decide if we move. The goal is to release a guide once the move is set in stone and we have done enough testing to grasp the basics of builds in FHM.

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#49

11-27-2019, 11:05 AMNONAME Wrote: When will we have a confirmation that FHM is the route we want to go (whether that is S52 or later doesn't matter)? In a perfect world, Friday would be great as it's on sale then. I'm sure many of us would rather buy it for $20 whatever then $46 it is right now. Understandably, this is a massive change and we might not have the answer by then though.
A decision will not be made for some time. So Friday is a very unlikely goal.

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#50

DT and company are definitely not rushing into it, as they want to make sure everything is good enough before making a switch.

My 2c nobody asked for is that it's a change we've been putting off for a long time. There will be bumps along the way, but the reason for change is to make it better. I'm just a floating eye in their discord conversations about testings and processes and how to transfer, but everything is done with the full intent of improving the game. I think they all understand we can keep band-aiding the problem while we working on a long term solution.

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#51

11-26-2019, 08:04 PMcaltroit_red_flames Wrote:
11-26-2019, 07:26 PMTnlAstatine Wrote: so regarding this, do we stick to fhm 7 or go with each new version?

I imagine we'll do what PBE does, examine the difference in each version and wait until it makes sense to move to the next one. Generally the differences are negligible and the answer is no.

do we stick to fhm 7 or go with each new version?

no

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#52

I'm very open to the change from STHS to FHM, but just to play devil's advocate on the subject, I'm curious why the decision was to leave STHS immediately? Reading through the comments there are legitimate concerns and valid points brought up when it comes to how the SHL has survived for such a long time without having to change engines. I'm curious why something like a harsher update scale isn't being looked at and we're immediately looking to switch sim engines?

I have no experience with FHM, but I've always been one to look for build diversity. At first glance it seems as though FHM will provide that, but I'm assuming we may end up experiencing the same thing and most users will gravitate towards similar builds. So I'm just curious why we decided to go the route of changing the sim engine instead of trying to fix the current state of the SHL and the use of STHS?

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#53

11-27-2019, 11:40 AMArGarBarGar Wrote:
11-27-2019, 11:05 AMNONAME Wrote: When will we have a confirmation that FHM is the route we want to go (whether that is S52 or later doesn't matter)? In a perfect world, Friday would be great as it's on sale then. I'm sure many of us would rather buy it for $20 whatever then $46 it is right now. Understandably, this is a massive change and we might not have the answer by then though.
A decision will not be made for some time. So Friday is a very unlikely goal.

It does go on sale on Friday. With all of the issues we've found with STHS it's better imo for people to buy it Friday and play a game or two with it. Figure out what you think works, find a build you want to make, learn some stuff so we don't have people thinking FHM is some incredibly complex beast.

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#54

11-27-2019, 12:13 PMOtrebor13 Wrote: I'm very open to the change from STHS to FHM, but just to play devil's advocate on the subject, I'm curious why the decision was to leave STHS immediately? Reading through the comments there are legitimate concerns and valid points brought up when it comes to how the SHL has survived for such a long time without having to change engines. I'm curious why something like a harsher update scale isn't being looked at and we're immediately looking to switch sim engines?

I have no experience with FHM, but I've always been one to look for build diversity. At first glance it seems as though FHM will provide that, but I'm assuming we may end up experiencing the same thing and most users will gravitate towards similar builds. So I'm just curious why we decided to go the route of changing the sim engine instead of trying to fix the current state of the SHL and the use of STHS?

The decision wasn't made immediately. Several people spent days searching for ways to make STHS work and when we found all the possibilities on how to fix STHS were inadequate the search for a new engine started. Nobody is rushing this despite what you may have been told. Lots of smart and diligent people are working on this, no stone is being left unturned.

In short a harsher update scale doesn't fix that fact that PA is a detrimental attribute, nor does any new version of STHS, nor do sliders. If you want more information @Tomen can offer more in depth information.

FHM fixes build diversity with roles. Roles are set by the coach/GM of a team. They cause you to play a certain style during a game. If you have better defensive attributes you'll be better at playing like a defensive forward, if you have better scoring it makes no sense to play like a defensive forward. You can't have a player that's playing like a sniper killing penalties but if you're built like a sniper you're going to be shit at killing penalties regardless. If people want to have good teams and win cups they'll need to have diverse builds. If you just want stats sure make everyone a sniper, but that's like having a god tier batting lineup with a garbage pitching staff in baseball. Maybe you'll get a lot of goals/runs but you're not going to win any championships that way.

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#55

11-27-2019, 12:16 PMcaltroit_red_flames Wrote:
11-27-2019, 11:40 AMArGarBarGar Wrote: A decision will not be made for some time. So Friday is a very unlikely goal.

It does go on sale on Friday. With all of the issues we've found with STHS it's better imo for people to buy it Friday and play a game or two with it. Figure out what you think works, find a build you want to make, learn some stuff so we don't have people thinking FHM is some incredibly complex beast.

I'm trying to be as optimistic as possible about this move, but seeing such a blasé approach to the notion anyone in the league, especially going into the holidays, can just happily plop down money on FHM to get a head start - particularly when the SHL has long prided itself on not being pay-to-play like other sim leagues - is really throwing me for a loop, especially if we can't even say concretely the shift is going to happen.

I'm not trying to be negative. I genuinely think that this is probably the right move for the league. But I am trying to be pragmatic.

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#56
(This post was last modified: 11-27-2019, 12:29 PM by Tomen.)

11-27-2019, 12:13 PMOtrebor13 Wrote: I'm very open to the change from STHS to FHM, but just to play devil's advocate on the subject, I'm curious why the decision was to leave STHS immediately? Reading through the comments there are legitimate concerns and valid points brought up when it comes to how the SHL has survived for such a long time without having to change engines. I'm curious why something like a harsher update scale isn't being looked at and we're immediately looking to switch sim engines?

I have no experience with FHM, but I've always been one to look for build diversity. At first glance it seems as though FHM will provide that, but I'm assuming we may end up experiencing the same thing and most users will gravitate towards similar builds. So I'm just curious why we decided to go the route of changing the sim engine instead of trying to fix the current state of the SHL and the use of STHS?
Both is actually happening. There are people that work on figuring out how to "fix" the problem we have with STHS for S52 and there are also people working on on a possible switch to FHM in S52/S53.

There are some possible fixes for STHS (which haven't been tested enough) but it most likely will only be a short term one or rather just trying to fix the symptom and not the cause ( and the cause is something we weren't able to so far).
There are 2 basic ideas so far which involve switching to the 2.1 sim engine and capping attributes combined with an update scale change.

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3. Buffalo Stampede , Eduard Selich 5 (Maximilian Wachter, Alexis Metzler) at 16:25
5. Buffalo Stampede , Eduard Selich 6 (Steven Stamkos Jr., Brynjar Tusk) at 19:48
8. Buffalo Stampede , Eduard Selich 7 (Brynjar Tusk, Alexis Metzler) at 13:55
9. Buffalo Stampede , Eduard Selich 8 (Anton Fedorov, Mikelis Grundmanis) at 15:12
10. Buffalo Stampede , Eduard Selich 9 (Dickie Pecker) at 19:43 (Empty Net)
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#57

Love to see the people who are against switching sim engine to show how we are going to fix the current issue. I've seen people bash their head against the wall trying to get some sort of positive result against the low passing/skating tactic to no avail.
I created my first player to be a playmaker and knowing that that archetype is just simply inferior in both ability to generate offense and defense in STSH kills the will to put any sort of progress into the player. Say we stay in STSH, give me one good reason as to why i shouldn't just kill of Passamus



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#58

11-27-2019, 12:24 PMztevans Wrote:
11-27-2019, 12:16 PMcaltroit_red_flames Wrote: It does go on sale on Friday. With all of the issues we've found with STHS it's better imo for people to buy it Friday and play a game or two with it. Figure out what you think works, find a build you want to make, learn some stuff so we don't have people thinking FHM is some incredibly complex beast.

I'm trying to be as optimistic as possible about this move, but seeing such a blasé approach to the notion anyone in the league, especially going into the holidays, can just happily plop down money on FHM to get a head start - particularly when the SHL has long prided itself on not being pay-to-play like other sim leagues - is really throwing me for a loop, especially if we can't even say concretely the shift is going to happen.

I'm not trying to be negative.  I genuinely think that this is probably the right move for the league.  But I am trying to be pragmatic.

I mean I didn't say everyone needs to buy it. I'm just saying it's gonna be 20 bucks and to go for it if you can afford it and want it.

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#59

11-27-2019, 12:30 PMMayuu Wrote: I created my first player to be a playmaker and knowing that that archetype is just simply inferior in both ability to generate offense and defense in STSH kills the will to put any sort of progress into the player.  Say we stay in STSH, give me one good reason as to why i shouldn't just kill of Passamus
The idea that high passing is detrimental to your player is absolutely asinine and again I really wish people would stop talking in absolutes.

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#60

What are the stats in FHM that make being a grinder or defensive player viable?

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