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Mark Rycroft, The Colorado Avalanche, and his hateful statements
(This post was last modified: 06-02-2020, 11:08 PM by Hallsy.)

06-02-2020, 10:45 PMCarbine Wrote:
06-02-2020, 10:37 PMWaters Wrote: Oh as long as it was only what you believed at the time

How can you come into a thread opposing everyone else’s opinion and not even know what you’re talking about
Because I don't spend every waking moment consuming social media and news reports on the protests? Not exactly healthy behavior.

but posting a billion times in a night on a online sim hockey league forum is the most healthy of behaviour on a topic you not even bother to do some research on other than some unbiased new source?
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I totally agree that the justice system in the US is messed up and clearly biased against pretty much every minority group in existence, but I do think saying ACAB is a reductive argument because police are so localized that saying every police system has these same issues is ignoring that not all police systems are made alike. Is burning down your own city ok? Absolutely not, I don't care who's doing it. Is it a coincidence that there's a lot more violence in cities that have had more police issues in the past? Nope. There are definitely people attempting to agitate or LARPing their anarchist fantasies, but all and all the real violent riots seem to be relatively confined to areas where there are problems w police. I live in Detroit, and shit has been comparatively calm both here and in nearby Flint because we have very good police chiefs that try to make police members of the community, not above it and it's really showed. This stuff should be standard countrywide but it's clearly not or we wouldn't be having these issues.

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06-02-2020, 08:16 PMhotdog Wrote:
06-02-2020, 07:15 PMjcfbey01 Wrote: I support peaceful protests that are occurring, I believe that all lives matter, no matter race, sex, or beliefs. But if you believe in shooting cops that are trying to protect and save their city, then don't talk to me because that's fucking messed up.

I support peaceful protests that are occurring, I believe that all lives matter, no matter race, sex, or beliefs. But if you believe in shooting cops black people that are trying to protect and save their city be alive, then don't talk to me because that's fucking messed up.
I completely agree with that too. I've never said I haven't agreed with that.

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(This post was last modified: 06-03-2020, 01:20 AM by DELIRIVM.)

The problem in a microcosm, which Rycroft displayed in my original post, is that apathy and status quo remain major enemies. The fact that a large swath of people care more about a business than fellow human's lives perfectly encapsulates the major issue we face in this country - and throughout the world. People think that people burning crosses and yelling slurs is the biggest threat to black people. But it's people like Amy Cooper, who knows she can abuse the systemic racism present to her advantage. This is the definition of privilege. Andrew Rycroft, who owns a liquor store miles and miles away from the protests, cares more about things staying the same so his business can thrive. Even if it means people dying and killing any momentum protesters create. This is privilege.

So to have someone like Carbine come into this thread and spread big brain Ben Shapiro bullshit does nothing but undermine all that people are fighting for right now. Rioting and destruction is the way people feel this protest. Sure, some small businesses may suffer and there will be a time to help those small businesses as we move forward. But we're undermining the action that helped create this country. The destruction of property, in the Boston Tea Party, was a major reason we're able to sit here and discuss these things as Americans (sorry Canadians, I love you too).

So instead of arguing that shit is whack @Carbine, go find the other thread and consider opening your wallet to help these people fighting for basic human rights.

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06-02-2020, 06:50 PMhhh81 Wrote: Also, violent protest was also a central part of the Civil Rights Movement, regardless of how sanitized and whitewashed much of the history has become especially around Dr. King. 

I wanted to address this because I feel like its a misleading headline and statement. King was very much nonviolent and was a lifelong pacifist (see stance on Vietnam), encouraged nonviolent means of protest, and trained people to not react to aggression. He did this because he knew the people in power would respond with violence (see Selma, Freedom Riders, and the whole Birmingham Campaign). King did not encourage people to riot and burn things. His idea (and a correct one) was that if you protest nonviolently, are met with violence, and don't react with violence you make yourself a martyr and victim in the eyes of the public, and highlight the injustices of the system.

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06-02-2020, 06:07 PMCarbine Wrote:
06-02-2020, 01:34 PMhhh81 Wrote: Does it need to stop, though?
Yes. I think that's pretty apparent to most people at this point.

Quote:The shift from "peaceful" protests to rioting/looting has very specific and important reasons. In part, escalation has been intentionally incited by police and White supremacists in city after city in hopes of discrediting this movement to the White moderate.
Defending riots and looting isn't a good look dude. I don't care what the cause is, violence and the destruction of people's livelihoods should never be acceptable by any society. Furthermore, you immediately discredit this movement by shifting the blame to police and so-called 'white supremacists'. Police are required to be there - it's their job to uphold the Constitution in the US (see here). I haven't seen anything from any news source to suggest 'white supremacists' are instigating either. Have you? Be careful not to provide a pasty white kid in blackout clothing as proof because I'm pretty sure that's the standard 'uniform' for the newly (or soon to be newly) designated terrorist group, Antifa.

Quote:Additionally, looting has a fundamental value and legitimacy within protests.

Sigh. No, it doesn't. Looting is stealing. It's a crime. A protest doesn't change that.

Quote:Trevor Noah explained it better than I could drawing on social contract theory and how the American social contract has been violated over. and over. and over. again over our history. When our nation's history and present actions both show that Black Americans are not included in the social contract of America, those laws have no moral authority and following them blindly is submission to oppression.
I have no idea what this 'social contract theory' thing is but perhaps it should stay as it's called: theory. A comedian probably isn't the best vehicle for explaining this kind of stuff either - regardless of his skin color. You wouldn't trust a fry cook, for example, with finding a cure to the coronavirus, would you?

Quote:Substantive change rarely comes from quietly asking the systems that be to change internally. There needs to be a disruption, a shake up, to the status quo.
Logically speaking, yes, you are correct when it comes to shaking up the status quo. However, the means do not justify the ends when it comes to this movement.
Rioting and looting will be and have been met with similarly destructive means by the police and private citizens so far. Police are oath-bound to confront these rioters (from the above link): “I, AB, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic..." Private citizens are entitled to self-defense through the 2nd Amendment to the US Constitution.

Now, with that being said, and before someone calls me a racist, I largely support the BLM movement and their right to peaceful protest, like every other person in a free society. They aren't being withheld from that right, even during a worldwide pandemic (which has oddly become less of a big deal over the past few days, it seems). I do not support the rioting and looting that are being sparked by these protests, however. George Floyd's family has said on numerous occasions that they want the violence to stop. Wasn't his death the reason this all boiled over? Why are the riots and looting continuing then?

And as for Mark Rycroft, the reason this thread even exists, come on. The dude owns a liquor store that, presumably, was being looted during one of the riots in Colorado. I'd be pissed too if my business was being destroyed by lawless thugs. While I don't wish for a similar kind of retribution that he described, the reaction to what was probably a very emotional night for him is absolutely justified. Maybe not on a public forum, and as a locally known sportscaster, but justified nonetheless.

It's not as if he was saying 'F*ck BLM' or something to that effect, despite how some people took it.

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06-02-2020, 10:23 PMCarbine Wrote:
06-02-2020, 08:06 PMwumaduce Wrote: Don't worry, he'll ghost on this thread just like he's ghosted on teams he's GM'd in multiple leagues. He's probably already hiding in his bunker with jcf.

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Why do you keep bringing Colorado up?

Why do you assume it was Colorado and not Vegas?

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@Carbine you completely avoided and skipped what I quoted you in about the Australian reporter... How were they inciting violence to justify the attack against them.

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06-02-2020, 10:45 PMCarbine Wrote:
06-02-2020, 10:37 PMWaters Wrote: Oh as long as it was only what you believed at the time

How can you come into a thread opposing everyone else’s opinion and not even know what you’re talking about
Because I don't spend every waking moment consuming social media and news reports on the protests? Not exactly healthy behavior.
Well now imagine being black/a person of color and having this "unhealthy behavior" of coming face to face with institutional racism not being a thing you can just turn off and walk away from. That's why people are protesting and rioting. Because peoples' voices and peaceful protests have produced virtually zero meaningful action towards creating a more equal society.

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06-02-2020, 09:03 PMCarbine Wrote:
06-02-2020, 06:58 PMGeckoeyGecko Wrote: carbine pls

you have things backwards. This isn't 'ah people are rioting and therefore the police are fighting back' this is 'police are attacking peaceful protesters and therefore there are riots happening'. What do you want people to do, man? roll over and die? These riots are the product of generations of built up hatred and injustice in America, and to say that they should just stop is foolish and unsympathetic at best.
You see, I just don't think police are just attacking protestors for no reason. I wouldn't say they're attacking them at all. If they actually were, such as in Hong Kong with their clashes with the Chinese-backed police force, then you'd have a stronger argument. The US government isn't just coming out and labeling Antifa a domestic terrorist organization for no reason. There is evidence, or at least some very convenient coincidences, that some of this chaos has been planned.

What I think is going on is that the BLM protestors are largely peaceful and that Antifa are the ones starting the chaos and attacking the police. Once that happens, the high emotions of these protests are drawing some of those protestors into the mayhem, making it seem like BLM are the ones attacking the police, or the police attacking the protestors, either or.

Regardless, I think the problem here is Antifa and their extreme views. Just my opinion, not at all saying it's 100% true but I certainly don't think it's 100% false.
ANTIFA isn’t an actual organization you fucking donkey

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