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grok · 02-23-2019, 12:42 AM

I emphasize with VAN over what appears to be a misunderstanding and a change in precedent for the rules, and admittedly the HO response time was below expectations. That said, it would have been trivial to inform HO that they would submit a valid roster after signing that FA and request a waiver or extension on that GM task, especially since the approver clearly posted the signing date in the thread.

Idk. Feels like everyone loses here except for the handbook. HO, VAN, and the player get a bad experience on this one. Oh well.

grok · 02-23-2019, 12:48 AM

02-23-2019, 12:16 AMspooked Wrote: Rules assume approval in reasonable time. If every approval took 31 hours the rule would probably be different cause thats a terrible turn around.

HO took time cause of being tied up, but why not just take the L and move on with class instead of forcing the FA to go somewhere else. This just makes the site look bad to new people two times in a row and doesnt accomplish much. Maybe make them wait another 24 hour period to sign or 12 even, but this is a bit silly imo even if rules exist.

I think those alternate punishments would have been better tbh. The reason to enforce this rule here is to ensure there was a fair amount of time for all teams to contact the player. Reversing the VAN signing and giving another 12-24 hours for GMs to contact jblock would have been a punishment closer to the spirit of the rule given the very minor (2 hours) violation.

Nobody · 02-23-2019, 12:49 AM

02-23-2019, 12:16 AMspooked Wrote: Rules assume approval in reasonable time. If every approval took 31 hours the rule would probably be different cause thats a terrible turn around.

HO took time cause of being tied up, but why not just take the L and move on with class instead of forcing the FA to go somewhere else. This just makes the site look bad to new people two times in a row and doesnt accomplish much. Maybe make them wait another 24 hour period to sign or 12 even, but this is a bit silly imo even if rules exist.

Because the rule is clear. It was very clearly stated that the player couldn't be signed until the 23rd.

***Blastmeaway*** · 02-23-2019, 12:56 AM

02-22-2019, 11:25 PMSleepy Wrote: Wait so , if I’m understanding this correctly, and please, correct me if I’m wrong, the SMHJL intern is the only person who approves new players now? What do the other members of HO do? Sit around and look at unapproved player pages wishing their intern was around to do something about it ?

Even if VAN did break the rules by signing a player early it’s honestly laughable it took HO 31 hours to approve someone. That’s not a good look. And y’all wonder why it’s sometimes a struggle to keep new players active.

its been that way for a while, afaik. @caltroit_red_flames got in trouble because he was having a busy day or something along those lines and wasn't able to approve players one day

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09-05-2018, 10:04 PMBeaver Wrote: Wow look what the PT affiliation has done to our pristine league.

12-19-2018, 12:31 AMBeaver Wrote: I personally blame the PT affiliation for handing out massive amounts of free TPE to all these players, inflating the TPE they're at when they get called up.

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spooked · 02-23-2019, 12:59 AM

02-23-2019, 12:49 AMNobody Wrote:
02-23-2019, 12:16 AMspooked Wrote: Rules assume approval in reasonable time. If every approval took 31 hours the rule would probably be different cause thats a terrible turn around.

HO took time cause of being tied up, but why not just take the L and move on with class instead of forcing the FA to go somewhere else. This just makes the site look bad to new people two times in a row and doesnt accomplish much. Maybe make them wait another 24 hour period to sign or 12 even, but this is a bit silly imo even if rules exist.

Because the rule is clear. It was very clearly stated that the player couldn't be signed until the 23rd.

Fair enough perspective to have. Just would personally prefer a more soft touch when it comes specifically to changing the destination of new members who just signed up is all. I'm not gonna ruin your day cause of a small ruling.

***caltroit_red_flames*** · 02-23-2019, 01:05 AM

02-23-2019, 12:56 AMBlastmeaway Wrote:
02-22-2019, 11:25 PMSleepy Wrote: Wait so , if I’m understanding this correctly, and please, correct me if I’m wrong, the SMHJL intern is the only person who approves new players now? What do the other members of HO do? Sit around and look at unapproved player pages wishing their intern was around to do something about it ?

Even if VAN did break the rules by signing a player early it’s honestly laughable it took HO 31 hours to approve someone. That’s not a good look. And y’all wonder why it’s sometimes a struggle to keep new players active.

its been that way for a while, afaik. @caltroit_red_flames got in trouble because he was having a busy day or something along those lines and wasn't able to approve players one day

Yep. I got labeled as lazy by that HO and wasn't included in HO stuff really. Honestly being SMJHL intern was one of the worst experiences for me on SHL. Felt entirely like a waste of time.

JNH · 02-23-2019, 01:08 AM

VAN is wrong for not making sure a player was eligible before offering the contract. It's easy to do, but also a mistake that's been made before. Fair punishment and I'm sure they'll check next time. Also saw that time zones play a role, that's shitty but again it happens.

That being said, I agree with @O4L, why do we have 1 person doing this? We hire an excessive amount of people into HO when 2-3 used to be sufficient and yet only one person is left this task where it's important to be done in a timely manner? The window to grab new rookies and keep them on the site is small and crucial, making them wait or turning their first contract into a shitshow (e.g. this suspension and making them go elsewhere) can make them quit. What kind of introduction to a league is this? It should never get to a point where they wait this long.

Sleepy · 02-23-2019, 01:15 AM

02-23-2019, 01:05 AMcaltroit_red_flames Wrote:
02-23-2019, 12:56 AMBlastmeaway Wrote: its been that way for a while, afaik. @caltroit_red_flames got in trouble because he was having a busy day or something along those lines and wasn't able to approve players one day

Yep. I got labeled as lazy by that HO and wasn't included in HO stuff really. Honestly being SMJHL intern was one of the worst experiences for me on SHL. Felt entirely like a waste of time.

oof

ztevans · 02-23-2019, 01:19 AM

02-23-2019, 01:05 AMcaltroit_red_flames Wrote:
02-23-2019, 12:56 AMBlastmeaway Wrote: its been that way for a while, afaik. @caltroit_red_flames got in trouble because he was having a busy day or something along those lines and wasn't able to approve players one day

Yep. I got labeled as lazy by that HO and wasn't included in HO stuff really. Honestly being SMJHL intern was one of the worst experiences for me on SHL. Felt entirely like a waste of time.

That's certainly a version of how that played out, but the statute of limitations is well past for all parties so I'm not going to fight over it.

***39alaska39*** · 02-23-2019, 01:31 AM

02-23-2019, 01:08 AMJNH Wrote: That being said, I agree with @O4L, why do we have 1 person doing this? We hire an excessive amount of people into HO when 2-3 used to be sufficient and yet only one person is left this task where it's important to be done in a timely manner? The window to grab new rookies and keep them on the site is small and crucial, making them wait or turning their first contract into a shitshow (e.g. this suspension and making them go elsewhere) can make them quit. What kind of introduction to a league is this? It should never get to a point where they wait this long.

Big on this. I strongly doubt that HO is always so busy that they can’t possibly approve a player. Interns shouldn’t be the only person able to do it because that seems highly flawed

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***caltroit_red_flames*** · 02-23-2019, 01:38 AM

02-23-2019, 01:19 AMztevans Wrote:
02-23-2019, 01:05 AMcaltroit_red_flames Wrote: Yep. I got labeled as lazy by that HO and wasn't included in HO stuff really. Honestly being SMJHL intern was one of the worst experiences for me on SHL. Felt entirely like a waste of time.

That's certainly a version of how that played out, but the statute of limitations is well past for all parties so I'm not going to fight over it.

Honestly I shouldn't have said anything. Bringing up old dirty laundry isn't going to help anyone or anything. My bad Zoone.

ztevans · 02-23-2019, 01:40 AM

02-23-2019, 01:38 AMcaltroit_red_flames Wrote:
02-23-2019, 01:19 AMztevans Wrote: That's certainly a version of how that played out, but the statute of limitations is well past for all parties so I'm not going to fight over it.

Honestly I shouldn't have said anything. Bringing up old dirty laundry isn't going to help anyone or anything. My bad Zoone.

I wasn't upset until you called me Zoone. Now you're dead to me. Laughing

***caltroit_red_flames*** · 02-23-2019, 01:45 AM

02-23-2019, 01:40 AMztevans Wrote:
02-23-2019, 01:38 AMcaltroit_red_flames Wrote: Honestly I shouldn't have said anything. Bringing up old dirty laundry isn't going to help anyone or anything. My bad Zoone.

I wasn't upset until you called me Zoone. Now you're dead to me.

Ah fuck lol my bad twice

ztevans · 02-23-2019, 01:51 AM

02-23-2019, 12:16 AMspooked Wrote: Rules assume approval in reasonable time. If every approval took 31 hours the rule would probably be different cause thats a terrible turn around.

HO took time cause of being tied up, but why not just take the L and move on with class instead of forcing the FA to go somewhere else. This just makes the site look bad to new people two times in a row and doesnt accomplish much. Maybe make them wait another 24 hour period to sign or 12 even, but this is a bit silly imo even if rules exist.

To bring us back on track...

Unfortunately, as much as it pains me to say it, this is one of those unfortunate, uncommon cases where the common-sense answer really ain't that simple. Similar to when Latvia got pinged for an early transfer a few seasons ago, the other GMs will rightfully argue that, by signing the player early, Vancouver robbed them of the opportunity to sign him. It's entirely possible his mind was well made up and none of that would have mattered, but the rules exist to allow every team to have a chance to make their pitch, and that didn't happen here.

It's a shitty deal all around, there is no winner. The player has to find a new home, HO looks bad for not approving the player sooner and enforcing a clearly-written timeline that has existed in the league for dozens of seasons, Vancouver looks bad because they're the ones getting punished. Sucks.

Daco · 02-23-2019, 02:08 AM

Fair play would dictate that the signing is void and reset, and if he wants to sign with us now he can. Gets rid of the HO issue and fair all around don't you want the new player to be happy as well and not a casualty of rule swirl.

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