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TheHockeyist · 08-30-2020, 10:42 PM

08-30-2020, 10:36 PMPremierBromanov Wrote:
08-30-2020, 10:01 PMTheHockeyist Wrote: how some Latin-based rules are no longer considered objectively correct.
the history behind this is actually worth knowing. The short of it is that the rules were created by the elite as a way to differentiate the poor from the rich, as writing itself was something that was out of reach from most people. As writing became more common, it was necessary to create little rules like "You can't end a sentence with a proposition" to further separate the educated rich from the uneducated poor.

You'll find most societal rules, like table manners, are derived from trying to figure out who is poor and who is not. This is still in effect today, as ebonics have emerged as their own dialect and is often sneered at by people who would preach "proper grammar" and all it seeks to say is "You are poor, and I am not".

I mean, we havent even dipped our toe into the ethnocentrism dripping from the idea of "write english the way I want you to write it".

Yes. Double negatives. Those were drilled as "avoid like the plague". Never use a double negative. I don't know how many times I was taught this, yet my native dialect doesn't use double negation.

It might be a bit of ethnocentrism or something - I did distance myself from those who were more "incorrect" by way of how they wrote/spoke/etc. barring non-native speakers of English (whom I am always glad to help out). Except for school, most of what I was exposed to was "proper" grammatical English, especially the written form. Thus when I see something that deviates from this coming from a native speaker, I die a bit inside.

Fitted2106 · 08-30-2020, 10:43 PM

You know what else is double negative

1hating
2on fitted media

PremierBromanov · 08-30-2020, 10:43 PM

08-30-2020, 10:42 PMTheHockeyist Wrote: Yes. Double negatives. Those were drilled as "avoid like the plague". Never use a double negative. I don't know how many times I was taught this, yet my native dialect doesn't use double negation.

It might be a bit of ethnocentrism or something - I did distance myself from those who were more "incorrect" by way of how they wrote/spoke/etc. barring non-native speakers of English (whom I am always glad to help out). Except for school, most of what I was exposed to was "proper" grammatical English, especially the written form. Thus when I see something that deviates from this coming from a native speaker, I die a bit inside.

time to adapt. We all feel differently about the way people type. You learn to let it go because its not that important. I personally seek to use punctuation to whatever effect i can because I enjoy expressing myself that way. Fitted doesn't, and while I don't care for it, its not really worth attacking someone over.

I will say this, we should keep our ramblings to a single thread.

Fitted2106 · 08-30-2020, 10:44 PM

You know what else is double negative

1hating
2on fitted media

Again but hotter

TheHockeyist · 08-30-2020, 10:46 PM

08-30-2020, 10:43 PMPremierBromanov Wrote:
08-30-2020, 10:42 PMTheHockeyist Wrote: Yes. Double negatives. Those were drilled as "avoid like the plague". Never use a double negative. I don't know how many times I was taught this, yet my native dialect doesn't use double negation.

It might be a bit of ethnocentrism or something - I did distance myself from those who were more "incorrect" by way of how they wrote/spoke/etc. barring non-native speakers of English (whom I am always glad to help out). Except for school, most of what I was exposed to was "proper" grammatical English, especially the written form. Thus when I see something that deviates from this coming from a native speaker, I die a bit inside.

time to adapt. We all feel differently about the way people type. You learn to let it go because its not that important. I personally seek to use punctuation to whatever effect i can because I enjoy expressing myself that way. Fitted doesn't, and while I don't care for it, its not really worth attacking someone over.

I will say this, we should keep our ramblings to a single thread.

Would be for the better perhaps. My style may just be more of the "technically correct" style. Also see my reply to grok earlier in this thread.

grok · 08-30-2020, 10:59 PM

08-30-2020, 10:31 PMTheHockeyist Wrote:
08-30-2020, 10:21 PMgrok Wrote: the assumptions you're making that i have a problem with are

1. internet english is the same dialect as spoken or even written english. the high speed communications needs have transformed how internet users use english to communicate so much that there's almost no value in direct comparisons to "school english" and this is very well studied in the linguistic space

2. fitted is a native english speaker. this subcommunity in specific has a very wide reach to folks in non-english speaking countries, and even if fitted does speak english as a first language it's shitty to see that attitude as someone with limited english speaking skills

3. english writing has to have predictable grammar to be valuable. i'm not about to claim fitted's media is fine art, but i think it's dishonest to say his writing is incomprehensible. i am certainly able to read it and derive value from it, even if it's challenging for different reasons than i'm used to.

i'm not trying to fight and i've said my piece. i just hope you think about why you're making those assumptions, and how you could change the way you engage with both people and writing by challenging those assumptions.

1. For me at least, the two, even three, are essentially the same. I speak, write, and type pretty much identically with little overlap in style, regardless of register or medium. Most of what I use varies depending on who I'm talking to, and I default to a semi-formal neutral style like the one I'm typing in right now.

2. Not every native speaker has learned the art of grammar and composition. Where I'm from, it was drilled heavily. We had a lot of "do this, not that" and "in these cases, never do this". I didn't attend a grammar school, but jeez. When I was in elementary school and we had to grade others' writing, I covered the page in red ink. Even at a young age, I was correcting spelling, editing in semicolons, and all of that fun stuff. Most people who were graded by me ended up failing and complained that I was being an unfair grader. I was only strictly following the rubric provided.

3. Predictable grammar, yes. I will say that his standard of writing violates much of what I was taught. If he were a student, I would inevitably give him more red ink than black and fail him. It is very challenging to read, and one glance at it results in an urge to get out the red pen, no, the urge to dismiss the entire thing as "start over unless you want to fail".

Hopefully you see where I'm coming from.

the common thread i see in your reply is assuming other people think and communicate like you do, and that you feel an obligation to correct them. the people on this site are not beneath you; they are peers and equals, and they don't have to obey your criticism. trying to be a language "fixer" will be a losing battle for you. i think you'll have a better experience on the site learning to enjoy content over form, or at least learning to skip media when it's not to your personal taste.

TheHockeyist · 08-30-2020, 11:01 PM

08-30-2020, 10:59 PMgrok Wrote:
08-30-2020, 10:31 PMTheHockeyist Wrote: 1. For me at least, the two, even three, are essentially the same. I speak, write, and type pretty much identically with little overlap in style, regardless of register or medium. Most of what I use varies depending on who I'm talking to, and I default to a semi-formal neutral style like the one I'm typing in right now.

2. Not every native speaker has learned the art of grammar and composition. Where I'm from, it was drilled heavily. We had a lot of "do this, not that" and "in these cases, never do this". I didn't attend a grammar school, but jeez. When I was in elementary school and we had to grade others' writing, I covered the page in red ink. Even at a young age, I was correcting spelling, editing in semicolons, and all of that fun stuff. Most people who were graded by me ended up failing and complained that I was being an unfair grader. I was only strictly following the rubric provided.

3. Predictable grammar, yes. I will say that his standard of writing violates much of what I was taught. If he were a student, I would inevitably give him more red ink than black and fail him. It is very challenging to read, and one glance at it results in an urge to get out the red pen, no, the urge to dismiss the entire thing as "start over unless you want to fail".

Hopefully you see where I'm coming from.
the common thread i see in your reply is assuming other people think and communicate like you do, and that you feel an obligation to correct them. the people on this site are not beneath you; they are peers and equals, and they don't have to obey your criticism. trying to be a language "fixer" will be a losing battle for you. i think you'll have a better experience on the site learning to enjoy content over form, or at least learning to skip media when it's not to your personal taste.

I'm already contacting HO and wondering if I was too harsh in my rant.

*Mutedfaith* · 08-31-2020, 01:38 AM

08-30-2020, 09:34 PMTheHockeyist Wrote:
08-30-2020, 09:32 PMbluesfan55 Wrote: doubt that highly since trella and dwight are doing a good job with the barracuda. they've got a bright future

Subjective. Look at Minnesota. I was told they were handling things well...

Boy, do you have separation issues? You were the one who wanted out, and ever since you've been nothing but a twat about it.

Our team and LR are perfectly fine without you. And apparantly NEW is realizing the same thing, or they would've protected you.

Also: if you don't speak the Queen's English, you're not allowed to correct others.

Duff101 · 08-31-2020, 03:50 AM

08-30-2020, 10:35 PMFitted2106 Wrote: Yo I'm from the hood sry I speak in slang blood

This made me spit out my tea laughing

Credit to Geck, Ragnar and Juni for sigs

***SpartanGibbles*** · 08-31-2020, 05:01 AM

08-30-2020, 09:34 PMTheHockeyist Wrote:
08-30-2020, 09:32 PMbluesfan55 Wrote: doubt that highly since trella and dwight are doing a good job with the barracuda. they've got a bright future

Subjective. Look at Minnesota. I was told they were handling things well...

Quote:No. Igor is still improving and he enjoys his present team. Satisfaction is more important to Igor than a Cup is. Set your standards low and you will be satisfied. I care not about the number of cups you win. I do care about you being arrogant and attacking me for offering constructive criticism.

Quote:Your GMs are worse than ours. Admittedly we don't have a GM currently but we're in the position to get one that's equally as good. We also have an active team and great rising prospects, while you have nothing.

Nothing.

Ever since your goalie left, you have nothing.

This explains why you lose game after game after game.

The only thing that's great about playing you is that we win.

A. Keep my team out of your mouth. You decided a few seasons after we had committed to a rebuild that it wasn't good enough for you. You could have gotten out right when it started but I made our situation clear to the entire team. I had 3 other actives walk away from the team just because I was named Head GM, so a 4th wouldn't have mattered. Then you flipped the switch so I traded you out, but you can't seem to get over it. I don't care what issues and problems you have IRL, On-Site, or anywhere else. None of that is an excuse for how you act towards others. If it was truly so horrible, why were you claiming to want to never leave MIN the night before. Focus on your own team because to us, you are an afterthought. By the time you decided to leave, no one on my team was coming to say "give him another chance" or "we want him here".

B. You don't even know the first thing about being a GM in the SHL, SMJHL, IIHF Fed Head, or even WJC. In fact for someone that likes to pick at others you have plenty of shortcomings yourself. I have nothing against Ace or anyone who takes over in NEW, but I have a feeling they are getting tired of dealing with your persona as much as everyone in MIN was by the time you were traded. You know next to nothing on how the league operates, yet you keep acting like someone who has all the answers. If I had to wager a guess, I would say there's a reason you were exposed to the expansion draft. But I don't think either team will take you because I doubt they want to deal with that in a new LR.

C. Your "Constructive Criticism" is anything but helpful. No one cares about the point you are trying to make and you go about it by acting like someone who is highly superior for some strange reason. You are not in some grand position where anyone is coming to ask you to correct them. I might not be a fan of Fitted's Media personally, but at least he doesn't go out of his way to attack someone based their writing style. I would take Fitted on my team 10/10 times before I would take you again. At least he seems to enjoy the league and is positive towards others. All you seem to do is get angry and take it out on others.

D. While were on success, NEW didn't make the playoffs either.... so I don't think you have much room to talk. You claim you don't care about Cups, yet you were always quick to bring up the S48 4-Star Win. You obviously do care, otherwise you would have never left MIN.

E. How can you claim you have better GM's when you don't have one? Ace was a great GM, but attacking Trella and Dwight out of nowhere is absurd. They have done amazing things after inheriting a team that went 0-50 the season before. But again you wouldn't know the work they put in. You literally have 0 knowledge of how active their LR is or how many prospects they have based on your responses.

Normally I try to focus on the positives in this league, because real life for most people sucks and this is a good escape full of friends. In the end, I hope you get some help, because you clearly need it. Not just for yourself but for the people around you.

PremierBromanov · 08-31-2020, 09:40 AM

08-31-2020, 05:01 AMSpartanGibbles Wrote: They have done amazing things after inheriting a team that went 0-50 the season before

actually it was trella's fault

KlusteR · 08-31-2020, 10:10 AM

ACapitalChicago · 08-31-2020, 10:31 AM

08-31-2020, 09:40 AMPremierBromanov Wrote:
08-31-2020, 05:01 AMSpartanGibbles Wrote: They have done amazing things after inheriting a team that went 0-50 the season before

actually it was trella's fault

God I hope this meme never dies