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JumpierPegasus · 04-04-2021, 02:04 AM

04-04-2021, 01:55 AMDollaBill Wrote:
04-04-2021, 01:46 AMJumpierPegasus Wrote: First of all, incredibly excited to have you be a part of the SFP locker room.

I think the disconnect you are feeling makes sense, you look at your success in the sim, and you see a player that would be a top 5 player based on that. I think people telling you that sim results don't matter are explaining it the wrong way. Sim results do really matter they are incredibly important, and teams want players who have good builds and perform well in the sim. Flacko Lagerfield is an HoF player, considrered one of the greats of the modern era and he wasn't a top earner, only had around 1500TPE, and honestly JSS sucks lmao. So he was looked upon as a top tier player considered one of the best of all time, worthy of the HoF, and heralded by Hamilton and wanted by all teams. So sim results matter and are incredibly important and teams NEED players who perform well. It's not all about locker room

Big issue here, is that sim results aren't the be all end all in the J. In your first year in the J you are a 155-250TPE player during the season, and some players are 4th liners in the J or are playing on bad teams that cause them to have worse stats. You have another 10x the TPE to earn in your career, meaning that you scoring 30 points for example in the J doesn't mean much when your build will change 10x over during your career as you grow. Unfortunately it's just the symptom of having guys drafted after 1 seasons in the J (doing more than that would cause a lot more players to go inactive). The biggest thing for GM's becomes team fit, positional fit, and TPE earning speed. Those are going to be the biggest factor for teams moving forward for who will be the best players and who will be able to be on their team for the next 10-15 seasons, which is going to be down to more than 1 season in the J

Realistically, recreates may go before you because they have had that past success showing they can build successful players rather than the fit in the LR. Keenan, for example, was selected by SFP first overall last year. While he's a recreate, he actually has no history with SFP or with Henrik or Smith. He happened to be a big earner, and had past success. That's the big thing with former players is that past success, so GM's tend to pick them because they are safer than a new player (but maybe not as possible at being quite as good).

I agree that disconnect is huge on the fact that sim success doesn't matter in the J year 1. But sim success will be massive when we get into the SHL. You will be coveted if you can make a good build and be a fantastic player in the sim regardless of anything else. So don't let people tell you it doesn't matter 100%. Unfortunately just doesn't matter quite as much with 155-250 builds since so much will change over the next 10-15 seaosns of your career in terms of build

I appreciate you taking the time to elaborate. This was an insightful post, really

Anytime. You are going to get some troll posts in here, or people not understanding where you are coming from. Thought I'd throw in some of my knowledge from being around here for a bit. Feel free to reach out if you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask. All is not for naught, when it comes down to it, teams with the best sim players will win a cup and the best GMs are the ones who build those teams. Production will always be huge

Hope you can reconcile on some of those different expectations coming in, based on your season, TPE earning, and passion I think you could have a great career, which is more important than a good first junior season (I'd know my first player was a flash in the pan junior player Wink

)

JumpierPegasus · 04-04-2021, 02:05 AM

04-04-2021, 01:56 AMJNH Wrote:
04-04-2021, 01:55 AMDollaBill Wrote: I appreciate you taking the time to elaborate. This was an insightful post, really

Classic @JumpierPegasus saying what I said but better & earlier. When will this tyranny end :(

Classic JNH, still in my shadow as always Wink

JNH · 04-04-2021, 02:05 AM

04-04-2021, 01:58 AMDollaBill Wrote:
04-04-2021, 01:48 AMJNH Wrote: Hey, I was super disappointed after my first SMJHL draft so I get what you're coming from. I was on tilt.

However, I don't want you to misconstrue what people have said. Success as a player in the sim at the J level in your rookie season doesn't matter as much because rookies get uneven levels of playing time and roles on their teams, in addition to the fact that was mentioned before which is that the player build that you'll join the SHL at (~800 TPE) is vastly different than the one you're playing with at ~250 TPE during the J regular season. It's really hard to correlate a good player from a rookie SMJHL season to their entire SHL career.

Once you get to the SHL level, success as a player in the sim obviously matters a lot more to your value but year 1 is less about on-ice success and more about your development as a member overall. To be honest, I had you pegged as a mid-late first round talent. You've written some really strong media pieces and have built up an impressive bank account.

It happens every year, players fall. Some GM's do go safer with their friends who have less TPE however that's not a you problem - that's a them problem. If they're going to potentially handicap their team then let them. Your team steals you in the early second AND gets someone else in the first round who's also first round calibre. Great, now you're set up really well for the future. Toronto had this a couple seasons ago getting SFresh & Tylar who are two of the top earners in their class in the early first & second respectively. They came 2nd in the heaviest division in the league last year.

It's been a long night and my brain isn't working nearly anywhere it should be. I don't know if any of what I wrote makes sense. End of the day, what I'm trying to say is that yes the league has an on & off-ice component. As a known commodity, some GM's favour recreates as inherently safer because you'll know vastly more about them than anything you can gain from a week or so of scouting new prospects. However, this doesn't stand for all GM's (as Keygan's pointed out) & this means literally nothing. You have an entire SHL career ahead of you to read media articles about how 'you're the biggest steal of the S59 draft' and how they 'can't believe you slipped to the 2nd round'. Pretty dope shit.

The "drafting friends" bit still bothers me, (as a competitor), but I get it. I appreciate your response. Priority of player performance in the sim matters to me. I keep referring back to my intent when joining the site. I was to play well in the sim and win championships. I value what happens in the LR, but it is all secondary to me in this game.

Yeah I get that how that could be frustrating for sure.

I guess my response to that would be that on top of familiarity for assurance of success, to a lot of people this site is a great place to de-stress with friends when you get home from school or work or whatever. People naturally want to play with their friends and that gives people who they're familiar with an extra draft stock bump. Chicago's certainly done that in the past but we've also gone for our share of first gens (all 4 of our picks this year were first gens).

Everyone joins and continues playing in the SHL for different reasons, sometimes they align with yours and sometimes like tonight they don't exactly.

Best of luck man Cheers

JNH · 04-04-2021, 02:06 AM

04-04-2021, 02:05 AMJumpierPegasus Wrote:
04-04-2021, 01:56 AMJNH Wrote: Classic @JumpierPegasus saying what I said but better & earlier. When will this tyranny end :(

Classic JNH, still in my shadow as always

Smfh I complement you and you come back with this. Classic JP.

SlashACM · 04-04-2021, 02:11 AM

04-04-2021, 01:43 AM39alaska39 Wrote:
04-04-2021, 01:37 AMKeygan Wrote: Over half the first round was first generation players though?

1/2/4/5/7/8/10/15/16/18
9 was also a new gen! But also the first 4 recreates off the board were HOFer, HOFer, 1750 last player and1750 last player. It’s not like someone that randomly recreated with a former 4th line scrub was going top 5

Leaving me off the list eh? I hope you and I can make it two more HOFers

JumpierPegasus · 04-04-2021, 02:15 AM

04-04-2021, 02:06 AMJNH Wrote:
04-04-2021, 02:05 AMJumpierPegasus Wrote: Classic JNH, still in my shadow as always

Smfh I complement you and you come back with this. Classic JP.

I mean uh...

You ummm

Classic JNH haha being a cool guy

Bfine · 04-04-2021, 02:16 AM

I think the other thing Bill is picture how all the rookies who went above you are feeling about this. We’ve all worked just as hard as you and you’re making it seem like your work is more important. Your alienating potential friends by attacking us and saying we’re worse than you. We were both frustrated after getting snubbed for the UCORCAL WJC team and you agreed with me on my post, and we both worked to get on another team. I understand you’re frustrated but the key isn’t to attack everyone and be salty, it’s to work harder and make do. I always liked seeing you in the Russia LR and I know this may be a flash it the pan, but now I’m worried being on a team with you due to the ego. No ones gonna force you to change, and we all want you to succeed in this league. We just want you to do it without bringing other people like me and Pasta down.

JNH · 04-04-2021, 02:30 AM

04-04-2021, 02:15 AMJumpierPegasus Wrote:
04-04-2021, 02:06 AMJNH Wrote: Smfh I complement you and you come back with this. Classic JP.

I mean uh...

You ummm

Classic JNH haha being a cool guy

Don't search too hard you might hurt yourself :(

DollaBill · 04-04-2021, 02:31 AM

04-04-2021, 02:16 AMMinnesotafine Wrote: I think the other thing Bill is picture how all the rookies who went above you are feeling about this. We’ve all worked just as hard as you and you’re making it seem like your work is more important. Your alienating potential friends by attacking us and saying we’re worse than you. We were both frustrated after getting snubbed for the UCORCAL WJC team and you agreed with me on my post, and we both worked to get on another team. I understand you’re frustrated but the key isn’t to attack everyone and be salty, it’s to work harder and make do. I always liked seeing you in the Russia LR and I know this may be a flash it the pan, but now I’m worried being on a team with you due to the ego. No ones gonna force you to change, and we all want you to succeed in this league. We just want you to do it without bringing other people like me and Pasta down.

Not at all. My angle and perspective, to this point, has been about results in the sim. My comments are not at all a knock on handlers or the work ya'll have done. Understand that I came to the S58 as a player sim n00b. I have had absolute tunnel vision this entire time. My perspective has been on the created players and how they have performed inside the game. I am lucky Sotakov has been one of the best. That said, this draft threw me for a loop. I have been punched in the face with so many variables that do not include how created players perform or are expected to perform in the game.

DollaBill · 04-04-2021, 02:35 AM

04-04-2021, 01:15 AMvisceralpotamus Wrote: Wasn't sure I'd reply to this....but what the heck. You're frustrated and I get it bud. And this is maybe an example of posting from a place of frustration and possibly it's something you wanna walk back later...I dunno.
What I can say is that I am a total rookie to this site as well. And I am pretty surprised that you're gonna be calling me out here out of the blue, much less accusing me of benefitting from nepotism, favouritism, or for being in some imagined old boys club.

All I can speak to is my own experience, and that is that every GM I spoke to was amazing, friendly and honest (especially my new Edmonton bros). I was drafted on a Newfoundland team that was so welcoming, helpful, and fun that I ended up getting way more invested in the SHL than I would have ever anticipated. My GM's at Berserkers spend time working on my builds, answering annoying questions.... I just can't say enough about how positive and damn wholesome everything is.

I'm sorry you didn't experience that. I'm personally happy to hear that you're gonna keep at it in the league. I think it's an awesome group of people, and I'm sure you're an awesome guy too. Totally get that frustration gets the best of us sometimes. Hoping that you can turn that into some positive energy for S59. Looking forward to our matchups this season.

Cheers, bud

Didn't mean to pick on you bro, but you have the most unique name of any player in our class and, to be honest, I didn't realize you were a serious player before tonight. Nothing personal...I was just unfamiliar with how much you've earned. Mocking a turtle also fits into the bit better.

All due respect. Congrats on being plucked for the next level. Look forward to crossing paths again.

ml002 · 04-04-2021, 02:35 AM

04-04-2021, 01:40 AMBoomcheck Wrote: Use that anger, harness it. I was shunned and got drafted late af on CC2 and went on to being one of the most productive guys of my class and made the MOST money on contract deals. Got constantly shafted by WJC teams, IIHF, the smjhl draft, the shl draft, the awards committee and the hof committee.

become the coldest russian american sniper around, play for the name on the back and not the logo. JODAN

okay but really. Think of stats in the SMJHl as something others don't think translate, you can use that angle when you're in the SHL and actually producing. Then it's legitimately valid.

Think of TPE as overall potential, and if you earned like 23rd in the draft or whatnot you need to put some more effort in to get to the SHL as fast as you can to prove your worth. positions of need etc all sound great but in the current SHL it takes several seasons for a guy to be of some value for the big leagues and that requires a lot of effort and hard work.

Maybe think of it as teams might think due to your russian heritage you might bolt for the KHL or something when the going gets tough, now you just need to stick it out and show you're the real deal. stay hungry.

You wrote all this and didn't even bring up the time I demoted you to the 3rd line in the playoffs. Proud of you boom you're really growing up

Credit to Copenhagen, Wasty, FlappyGiraffe, InciteHysteria, and caltroit_red_flames
[Image: MM4nqx6.png]

Alyxander · 04-04-2021, 03:24 AM

Sammy Savage and his 30th Overall Elbows will see you on the ice, bud

**bbjygm** · 04-04-2021, 03:32 AM

If this is how you react to not meeting personal expectations, then perhaps the teams that didn't draft you dodged a bullet...

Boomcheck · 04-04-2021, 04:21 AM

04-04-2021, 02:35 AMml002 Wrote:
04-04-2021, 01:40 AMBoomcheck Wrote: Use that anger, harness it. I was shunned and got drafted late af on CC2 and went on to being one of the most productive guys of my class and made the MOST money on contract deals. Got constantly shafted by WJC teams, IIHF, the smjhl draft, the shl draft, the awards committee and the hof committee.

become the coldest russian american sniper around, play for the name on the back and not the logo. JODAN

okay but really. Think of stats in the SMJHl as something others don't think translate, you can use that angle when you're in the SHL and actually producing. Then it's legitimately valid.

Think of TPE as overall potential, and if you earned like 23rd in the draft or whatnot you need to put some more effort in to get to the SHL as fast as you can to prove your worth. positions of need etc all sound great but in the current SHL it takes several seasons for a guy to be of some value for the big leagues and that requires a lot of effort and hard work.

Maybe think of it as teams might think due to your russian heritage you might bolt for the KHL or something when the going gets tough, now you just need to stick it out and show you're the real deal. stay hungry.

You wrote all this and didn't even bring up the time I demoted you to the 3rd line in the playoffs. Proud of you boom you're really growing up

good thing ownership replaced you shortly afterwards

DELIRIVM · 04-04-2021, 04:33 AM

Sucks falling further than you want to fall. I was picked #28 in the S55 draft and it was a bit of a surprise to me. People want to be wanted. But the best thing you can do is just keep quiet, earn consistently, and make people wish they took a chance on you earlier in the draft. No reason to get really worked up about it. A lot of opportunities to show what you got in the SHL.

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