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**The__Y-man__100** · 01-07-2020, 12:08 PM

Yeah the sjw’s get mad at everything, they have nothing better to do with their time

First ever Yukon Malamute draft pick (1st overall S65)

SecondSucks22 · 01-07-2020, 12:10 PM

01-07-2020, 12:05 PMChris-McZehrl Wrote:
01-07-2020, 11:56 AMSecondSucks22 Wrote: Also, and i only ask this cause i know for a fact you wouldnt bring it up without someone in mind, who are you specifically talking about, which player and which team

excatly I wont bring it up to you! if I would bring it up than probably to my buddy Eggy!
let me do this scenario because the most only see if they are involved!
if a team would invite a player from VAN (SMJHL) or HAM (SHL) and this player isnt an alumni or something else ... he like it in that LR and decide to want to be there .... is that convincing? is that hurting the other team?
Because the player could like it personally so much that he want out of the other team or easily have a FA destination .... right?
would this player/member have the same situation without being tampered in a LR there he never should be on? I dont believe so!
back to the topic .... SHL FORUM ... why no member who isnt currently on the roster can be in the LR? let us say .... MIN player but send down Daniel Bischoff ... why he isnt on the VAN LR and never would be? maybe it would be tampering because he has nothing to do there? or do you believe its a joke? maybe too many believe the SHL is a joke? idk
fact is ... alone with the risk that i could convince someone with the presence in the own LR would scare me away about those actions!

in the discord you should have sections only for the team
sections there can alumnis be involved
but members they were never be on the team .... then better create a new server for those shit! but not in a SHL Team Discord LR! that is the way some of the newer members wanted to! Discord LR! but then use it how it should be use!!!!!!!

In this scenario, where parts of the team discord are locked to the player, and all they had access to was a specific room specifically for gaming, then that player deciding they liked it there would have nothing to do with the quality of the LR and everything to do with the quality of the people in it. In that way it wouldnt make a difference if you made a completely new server. I for one specifically joined hamilton because i liked several people in that discord from interactions I had had with them in various other LR's, but I didnt join hamilton because of those LR's that I was in with them, but because they were cool and friendly people. Your argument here is completely invalid, and you know that, but you want to argue and create more issue where there really doesnt need to be any, especially given the current constant hostility in the league, especially if you have a specific team in mind for this stance youve decided to take completely out of the blue

Chris-McZehrl · 01-07-2020, 12:20 PM

01-07-2020, 12:10 PMSecondSucks22 Wrote:
01-07-2020, 12:05 PMChris-McZehrl Wrote: excatly I wont bring it up to you! if I would bring it up than probably to my buddy Eggy!
let me do this scenario because the most only see if they are involved!
if a team would invite a player from VAN (SMJHL) or HAM (SHL) and this player isnt an alumni or something else ... he like it in that LR and decide to want to be there .... is that convincing? is that hurting the other team?
Because the player could like it personally so much that he want out of the other team or easily have a FA destination .... right?
would this player/member have the same situation without being tampered in a LR there he never should be on? I dont believe so!
back to the topic .... SHL FORUM ... why no member who isnt currently on the roster can be in the LR? let us say .... MIN player but send down Daniel Bischoff ... why he isnt on the VAN LR and never would be? maybe it would be tampering because he has nothing to do there? or do you believe its a joke? maybe too many believe the SHL is a joke? idk
fact is ... alone with the risk that i could convince someone with the presence in the own LR would scare me away about those actions!

in the discord you should have sections only for the team
sections there can alumnis be involved
but members they were never be on the team .... then better create a new server for those shit! but not in a SHL Team Discord LR! that is the way some of the newer members wanted to! Discord LR! but then use it how it should be use!!!!!!!

In this scenario, where parts of the team discord are locked to the player, and all they had access to was a specific room specifically for gaming, then that player deciding they liked it there would have nothing to do with the quality of the LR and everything to do with the quality of the people in it. In that way it wouldnt make a difference if you made a completely new server. I for one specifically joined hamilton because i liked several people in that discord from interactions I had had with them in various other LR's, but I didnt join hamilton because of those LR's that I was in with them, but because they were cool and friendly people. Your argument here is completely invalid, and you know that, but you want to argue and create more issue where there really doesnt need to be any, especially given the current constant hostility in the league, especially if you have a specific team in mind for this stance youve decided to take completely out of the blue

I believe in your words 100% but what if you should prove it! what if there is any sentences it would bring you and HAM in trouble and after a fight in this LR anyone leak this!? just hypothetically?
alone for this risk I wouldnt allow this as Head GM or Co-GM! NEVER!

and we all know that tampering is never be same! we had many different ways of tampering in the SHL history! and you also with Canada or not? there the punishment is like a joke in comparison to SHL!

mxman991 · 01-07-2020, 12:21 PM

01-07-2020, 11:27 AM. Grapehead Wrote:
01-07-2020, 10:44 AMSlappydoodle Wrote: I largely agree with (and this might be a first) McZ on this one. People that talk dismissively or contemptuously regarding STHS are not helping the situation. Shitting on the sim engine we've used very successfully for fifty seasons, whether its because you want to promote the switch to FHM or some other, personal reason counterproductive and unwise. Anything that tends to invalidate or belittle the league's long and proud history is hurting us at a time when we can ill afford it.

Just one opinionated loudmouths view here

I don't think there's any reason to discredit the long history of the league. It's just that it kind of ended at S50 in my heart. The flaws that were exposed this past offseason are very serious, and make it hard to care about a league using STHS anymore. That doesn't take away from the history the league built up over 50 seasons. It's that history that makes this all so much more frustrating. In my opinion though, the fingers should be pointed at the people who insisted on exploiting this flaw, and not the people who are upset with the fallout. I'm with you though on the history of the league, and preserving that, but I think there is room to criticize STHS without bad mouthing the SHL.

There has been plenty of finger pointing over this exploit discovery. I think that the SHL needs to come together and move past this to find a solution instead of casting anger to those who found a flaw and chose to use it. It was only a matter of time before someone found it anyways and did the same. What's important is how we all move on and figure out how to make it work again. There are solutions, we have to stop looking at everything as destroyed and instead look at it as an opportunity to grow.

Chris-McZehrl · 01-07-2020, 12:24 PM

01-07-2020, 12:21 PMmxman991 Wrote:
01-07-2020, 11:27 AM. Grapehead Wrote: I don't think there's any reason to discredit the long history of the league. It's just that it kind of ended at S50 in my heart. The flaws that were exposed this past offseason are very serious, and make it hard to care about a league using STHS anymore. That doesn't take away from the history the league built up over 50 seasons. It's that history that makes this all so much more frustrating. In my opinion though, the fingers should be pointed at the people who insisted on exploiting this flaw, and not the people who are upset with the fallout. I'm with you though on the history of the league, and preserving that, but I think there is room to criticize STHS without bad mouthing the SHL.

There has been plenty of finger pointing over this exploit discovery. I think that the SHL needs to come together and move past this to find a solution instead of casting anger to those who found a flaw and chose to use it. It was only a matter of time before someone found it anyways and did the same. What's important is how we all move on and figure out how to make it work again. There are solutions, we have to stop looking at everything as destroyed and instead look at it as an opportunity to grow.

in my opinion this latest heat against HAM was only because it was brought up in the offseason but HAM still made that instead to react and change it! I believe there is no other issue about S51!

**RomanesEuntDomus** · 01-07-2020, 12:28 PM

01-07-2020, 12:08 PMThe__Y-man__100 Wrote: Yeah the sjw’s get mad at everything, they have nothing better to do with their time

At this point the whining about the SJWs has become more annoying than the SJWs themselves. Not just here but in general.

**RomanesEuntDomus** · 01-07-2020, 12:37 PM

01-07-2020, 12:21 PMmxman991 Wrote:
01-07-2020, 11:27 AM. Grapehead Wrote: I don't think there's any reason to discredit the long history of the league. It's just that it kind of ended at S50 in my heart. The flaws that were exposed this past offseason are very serious, and make it hard to care about a league using STHS anymore. That doesn't take away from the history the league built up over 50 seasons. It's that history that makes this all so much more frustrating. In my opinion though, the fingers should be pointed at the people who insisted on exploiting this flaw, and not the people who are upset with the fallout. I'm with you though on the history of the league, and preserving that, but I think there is room to criticize STHS without bad mouthing the SHL.

There has been plenty of finger pointing over this exploit discovery. I think that the SHL needs to come together and move past this to find a solution instead of casting anger to those who found a flaw and chose to use it. It was only a matter of time before someone found it anyways and did the same. What's important is how we all move on and figure out how to make it work again. There are solutions, we have to stop looking at everything as destroyed and instead look at it as an opportunity to grow.

There is a difference though between merely finding an exploit while looking for an edge, and still choosing to take advantage of it as much as possible even after it had been shown how this hurts the league as a whole and maybe even threatens its existence. I have defended HAM quite a bit when it comes to this, but I can't really blame the people who are mad at them when stuff like this is out there:

[Image: image0.jpg]

It's this "We'll burn this whole place down if we have to in order to win a cup" attitude that has people upset along with the dickish behaviour of some of their players whenever this topic comes up, not the exploit itself. Which is kinda ironic because I don't think the exploit is actually as bad/potent as many seem to think, it's how people have responded to it, both on HAM and in the anti-HAM camp, that is causing the real harm.

mxman991 · 01-07-2020, 12:43 PM

01-07-2020, 12:37 PMRomanesEuntDomus Wrote:
01-07-2020, 12:21 PMmxman991 Wrote: There has been plenty of finger pointing over this exploit discovery. I think that the SHL needs to come together and move past this to find a solution instead of casting anger to those who found a flaw and chose to use it. It was only a matter of time before someone found it anyways and did the same. What's important is how we all move on and figure out how to make it work again. There are solutions, we have to stop looking at everything as destroyed and instead look at it as an opportunity to grow.

There is a difference though between merely finding an exploit while looking for an edge, and still choosing to take advantage of it as much as possible even after it had been shown how this hurts the league as a whole and maybe even threatens its existence. I have defended HAM quite a bit when it comes to this, but I can't really blame the people who are mad at them when stuff like this is out there:

It's this "We'll burn this whole place down if we have to in order to win a cup" attitude that has people upset along with the dickish behaviour of some of their players whenever this topic comes up, not the exploit itself. Which is kinda ironic because I don't think the exploit is actually as bad/potent as many seem to think, it's how people have responded to it, both on HAM and in the anti-HAM camp, that is causing the real harm.

You're right, and you posting that comment, which I am not sure if it was a direct message to you or not, seems very much like you're intentionally throwing more gas on the fire. My point is that yes that was a problem, but we need to work together now to figure out how to move forward. The damage was done, and it has been over a month of finger pointing and not enough coming together and problem solving. Just my opinion though, I am new here so I don't think I have as much of a horse in the race.

**RomanesEuntDomus** · 01-07-2020, 12:55 PM

01-07-2020, 12:43 PMmxman991 Wrote:
01-07-2020, 12:37 PMRomanesEuntDomus Wrote: There is a difference though between merely finding an exploit while looking for an edge, and still choosing to take advantage of it as much as possible even after it had been shown how this hurts the league as a whole and maybe even threatens its existence. I have defended HAM quite a bit when it comes to this, but I can't really blame the people who are mad at them when stuff like this is out there:

It's this "We'll burn this whole place down if we have to in order to win a cup" attitude that has people upset along with the dickish behaviour of some of their players whenever this topic comes up, not the exploit itself. Which is kinda ironic because I don't think the exploit is actually as bad/potent as many seem to think, it's how people have responded to it, both on HAM and in the anti-HAM camp, that is causing the real harm.
You're right, and you posting that comment, which I am not sure if it was a direct message to you or not, seems very much like you're intentionally throwing more gas on the fire. My point is that yes that was a problem, but we need to work together now to figure out how to move forward. The damage was done, and it has been over a month of finger pointing and not enough coming together and problem solving. Just my opinion though, I am new here so I don't think I have as much of a horse in the race.

It's not something that was sent to me personally, it's a screenshot that has been circulating on Discord that I have seen on multiple different servers at this point, so I took it to be somewhat common knowledge. You are right though that this probably adds a bit more fuel to the fire in case there are a lot of people who haven't seen it yet, but then again I think it's also important to recognize how unrelenting the people who found the exploit still seem to be. And it's kinda tough to follow your absolutely justified calls for unity when key people involved in this process still so clearly put personal gain over the good of the league.

Keygan · 01-07-2020, 01:10 PM

01-07-2020, 12:55 PMRomanesEuntDomus Wrote:
01-07-2020, 12:43 PMmxman991 Wrote: You're right, and you posting that comment, which I am not sure if it was a direct message to you or not, seems very much like you're intentionally throwing more gas on the fire. My point is that yes that was a problem, but we need to work together now to figure out how to move forward. The damage was done, and it has been over a month of finger pointing and not enough coming together and problem solving. Just my opinion though, I am new here so I don't think I have as much of a horse in the race.

It's not something that was sent to me personally, it's a screenshot that has been circulating on Discord that I have seen on multiple different servers at this point, so I took it to be somewhat common knowledge. You are right though that this probably adds a bit more fuel to the fire in case there are a lot of people who haven't seen it yet, but then again I think it's also important to recognize how unrelenting the people who found the exploit still seem to be. And it's kinda tough to follow your absolutely justified calls for unity when key people involved in this process still so clearly put personal gain over the good of the league.

It was posted publicly in the Vancouver Whalers discord.

The reason the forums are dead lately is because 25 teams have players that have essentially been told S51 and S52 are worthless because Hamilton will have been using the exploit for two seasons.

We’re literally wasting 4(?) 5(?) months of our lives on seasons that will end up holding no worth by the end of it because of how tainted they are by the exploit.

jRuutu · 01-07-2020, 01:13 PM

I still cant understand why HAM (and other teams/players) were allowed to keep those builds, when you compare the two: 1) let them keep the builds OR 2) put couple updaters to revert their builds back to what they were = the second one feels a lot better?

Sure, some regression players and their builds were reverted, but looking at Hamiltons roster right now it looks pretty bad and everybody is now doing it or going to do it. 20 between SC and PA is not enough. Weird call to let it happen. More urgency and power to fight against certain words than something that can potentially even destroy the league.

mxman991 · 01-07-2020, 01:16 PM

01-07-2020, 01:10 PMKeygan Wrote:
01-07-2020, 12:55 PMRomanesEuntDomus Wrote: It's not something that was sent to me personally, it's a screenshot that has been circulating on Discord that I have seen on multiple different servers at this point, so I took it to be somewhat common knowledge. You are right though that this probably adds a bit more fuel to the fire in case there are a lot of people who haven't seen it yet, but then again I think it's also important to recognize how unrelenting the people who found the exploit still seem to be. And it's kinda tough to follow your absolutely justified calls for unity when key people involved in this process still so clearly put personal gain over the good of the league.

It was posted publicly in the Vancouver Whalers discord.

The reason the forums are dead lately is because 25 teams have players that have essentially been told S51 and S52 are worthless because Hamilton will have been using the exploit for two seasons.

We’re literally wasting 4(?) 5(?) months of our lives on seasons that will end up holding no worth by the end of it because of how tainted they are by the exploit.

I thought that is why the league is putting new rules into place? Seems like the logical correction to change it and prevent it from bringing down S52.

Chris-McZehrl · 01-07-2020, 01:20 PM

01-07-2020, 01:16 PMmxman991 Wrote:
01-07-2020, 01:10 PMKeygan Wrote: It was posted publicly in the Vancouver Whalers discord.

The reason the forums are dead lately is because 25 teams have players that have essentially been told S51 and S52 are worthless because Hamilton will have been using the exploit for two seasons.

We’re literally wasting 4(?) 5(?) months of our lives on seasons that will end up holding no worth by the end of it because of how tainted they are by the exploit.
I thought that is why the league is putting new rules into place? Seems like the logical correction to change it and prevent it from bringing down S52.

it was known before S51 was started! maybe the bathtub was not big enough! idk Ninja

mxman991 · 01-07-2020, 01:23 PM

01-07-2020, 01:20 PMChris-McZehrl Wrote:
01-07-2020, 01:16 PMmxman991 Wrote: I thought that is why the league is putting new rules into place? Seems like the logical correction to change it and prevent it from bringing down S52.

it was known before S51 was started! maybe the bathtub was not big enough! idk

I agree with a comment up above, why was this just not nipped in the bud by reverting the move HAM made? Couldn't we have just restored them to their former build, put out a rule preventing these sorts of builds in the future and moved on like nothing happened?

Segi · 01-07-2020, 01:26 PM

01-07-2020, 01:23 PMmxman991 Wrote:
01-07-2020, 01:20 PMChris-McZehrl Wrote: it was known before S51 was started! maybe the bathtub was not big enough! idk
I agree with a comment up above, why was this just not nipped in the bud by reverting the move HAM made? Couldn't we have just restored them to their former build, put out a rule preventing these sorts of builds in the future and moved on like nothing happened?

Not really. Because it became apparent that no matter how you restrict builds, there will always be 1 build that's clearly better than others. Those restrictions can help for a couple of seasons, but they can't be a permanent solution.

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